Hi over the last few year i have had my eyes opened to the fact there are throws in karate and the founders of the main styles wado, shotokan, used them as part of there training is it just the fact that karate is kumite/sport based now that we dont teach or learn them anymore
Ermm - thats me isn't it? Mitlov's right to a point. Wado probably does have a greater amount of throws in it, but what perhaps its methodology / approach does seem to focus on more is "kuzushi" orientated techniques - more than Nage waza per-se. Although we have got a couple of blinders tucked up our dogi sleeve. Gary
I think this is an interesting point. (modern) Karate never really claimed/s to have throws so why expect them? That being said, you can definitely find throws if you want to, and I certainly practice them whenever I get the chance. In other words any time we do bunkai - I'm always looking for throws and locks and breaks, rather than blocks and punches. I think it comes down to how the individual trains, rather than what the style provides.
I'd say there's a small number of throws that many karateka learn - osoto gari, kouchi gari, ashi barai, ogoshi - most karate people will know at least some form of these throws, even if they don't know what they're called. They're all legal in sport kumite so even many sport-only clubs will learn them.
Surely some modern styles do and would indeed claim to have throws? Karate suffers from the same thing as TKD in that people go on youtube, see a couple of videos and assume they are representative of TKD. What they see is Olympic sparring, nothing like what I do with my guys. In Karate's case people see Shotokan Kumite and assume karate doesn't have throws. Mitch
Ogoshi is legal in sports kumite? On another note, as I've stated in previous threads, I think there's a difference between most karate 'throws' and the dynamic reaps and hip throws of Judo & (most) Ju-jitsu. IMO many karate stances are designed to drive into the opponents stance, breaking his posture and so making him easy to throw. Karateka often just add a few Judo throws to their repetoire but I think they'd be better off looking for the throws and takedowns within their own kata. I've never seen a kata movement that properly represents o-goshi. Mike
bold: fair point actually. I rescind. second point: yeah - but they'd have to look fairly hard to find videos that explicitly have throws - i.e. they'd have to make a conscious effort to find them. Also, maybe I should have said most styles of karate don't emphasise throws. In the end, it's primarily a striking art, and that's why people take it.
According to Joe Rogan, karate doesn't have throws, it has "trips." And Joe Rogan is smrt. In all seriousness, I'm pretty sure I've seen Mikio Yahara full-on throw somebody (I can't remember whether it was a hip throw or a sacrifice throw, but it was one of the two) during some of those 1980s JKA nationals videos on YouTube.
Absolutely and quite right too; throws locks etc are a support system that sit behind or to lend advantage to strikes. Mitch
even kani basami is legal in sport kumite the thing is that you can't throw them above your hip EDIT: d'oh! triple ninja'd! response was to mike
hi but dont you think that as most karate clubs claim to teach self defence that we are selling our selfs short by not teaching all ranges or is it that most students are kids and most s/p stuff you could not show ps i am a sport karate guy not jutsu but how can you claim to teach s/p when most of your training is to win comps personnely i tell adults that what i teach is sport and leave it up to them if they still want to train with me as big little guy who wants to rip into you dont care if you do comps or are a world champ having a consential fight
Do they? We learn how we might use some techniques in self defence, but we don't train 'self defence'. We repeat movements thousands of times so we can react and use them instinctively but we don't learn self defence. I think it's an important distinction to make. karate clubs that advertise straight up self defence are either lying, deluded, or actually dedicate a time period to learning actual simple no nonsense self defence.
