Text Books for 4th - 5th - and above?

Discussion in 'Kuk Sool' started by tulsa, Aug 7, 2011.

  1. ImaJayhawk

    ImaJayhawk Valued Member

    Hmm I remember Jane Hollander mentions both leopard and bear in her article...

    "Other lesser-known animals, commonly thought of in martial circles, including
    the bear and leopard, are also seen in Kuk Sool. A bear is actually a defensive
    animal. It fights standing upright and uses extreme bulk, body balance and
    strength to power its large paws. Some Kuk Sool palm techniques, requiring a
    strong stance, are taken from the bear's fighting strategy. Leopards are strictly
    attack animals using extreme speed. The leopard´s fighting tactic is that it
    doesn´t care or worry about retaliation. The animal´s speed is so great that it
    neutralizes the speed and power of the opponent. That is exactly the theory that
    brings the leopard into Kuk Sool Won. There are no special hand techniques
    characterizing the leopard, just blinding speed and forward thrusting power."
  2. unknown-KJN

    unknown-KJN Banned Banned

    For the record, Jayhawk, I believe that even though Ms. Hallander may have included the leopard as a MA animal totem utilized by the koreans when teaching TKMA, since she was a CMA practitioner, there's no way to be certain that she wasn't influenced by her own MA teachers when writing about TKMA (in many of her articles, she often explains KMA concepts from a CMA perspective, assuming that her reading audience might be more familiar with it for some reason :rolleyes: ). I'm not saying that KMA is devoid of a leopard totem, just that it's heavily downplayed in comparison to CMA.

    FWIW, I've also heard korean masters refer to a mythical beast (somewhat akin to a gryphon) rather than the leopard, when trying to cull blazingly fast MA movements from their students. ;)
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2012
  3. Bruce W Sims

    Bruce W Sims Banned Banned

    Yes, S-K thats a very good example of the point I was working to make. In the case of the Nanjing Central National School, what came to be called "Long Fist" (often confused with the traditional Boxing of the same name) was an amalgamation of five Boxing styles. Dr. YANG Jwing-ming has a very fine history of this in his book on Long Fist. The forms were constructed by the instructors at the Central GUOSHU Institute. OTOH the various five styles were all selected for their practicality rather than esoterica after the approach championed by the famous Chinese Boxer, HUO Yuan-jia who founded the renowned CHINGWU Physical Education Society in Shanghai in 1909.

    May I also mention that the Boxer I cited above was a master in the art of "Lost Track Boxing" also known as YANQINGQUAN or MIZONGQUAN. I have examined a two-book set by Masters CHEN Fenqi and CHEN Youliang and have found these resources (ISBN-s 7-5054-0127-0 & 7-5054-0126-2) to be very rich in information of the sort that would lend itself to the project under discussion. Of particular interest might be the two-person combat forms TAOHUANSAN and ZHAIKOUZI located at the end of each of the works respectively. FWIW.

    Best Wishes,

  4. unknown-KJN

    unknown-KJN Banned Banned

    Thanks, Bruce. I agree that training 2-man sets is very important in being able to wrap one's head around some of the more intricate aspects of MA, whether dealing with H2H methods or weapons, but due to the misconception surrounding "martial theater" (a term promoted by our beloved BWSims in several threads in the KS section of MAP, but a term which I've grown rather fond of), some folks end up simply thinking of 2-man sets as merely *choreography* that has to be learned, which is a far cry from the true benefit these drills have to offer.
  5. SsangKall

    SsangKall Valued Member

    yyyyyyesss, kun dae ryeon could be expanded infinitely.
  6. Bruce W Sims

    Bruce W Sims Banned Banned

    GoTta tell ya, Unknown.....I was going to say "Bingo" but I can't find a font size big enough to reflect my emotions!

    Traditional Forms are incredibly misunderstood. The 2-person forms are less combat forms and more of a pre-arranged syllabus for material of a particular level. Along with allowing people to have a mnemonic device for recalling individual techniques, these forms also demonstrate transitions from one grapple to another, conversions among strikes, kicks and grapples and alternate applications for the same biomechanics. There are also individual forms for solitary practice that can likewise be deconstructed into their elements, allowing for focus on a particular aspect. Much Good Stuff.

    BTW: This is also why I am such a fan of the 2-person sword-form in the MYTBTJ.

    Best Wishes,

  7. doomx2001

    doomx2001 Valued Member

    I realize that this is an old thread, but one worth reviving. I for one, would love to have text books on the higher grade Kuk Sool material that goes in depth on the techniques. Has any new progress been made? Are they for purchase?
  8. tulsa

    tulsa Valued Member

    we are still working on a EBook version. It will be multi media and made in 2 parts. the first part will be for the student. The second will be the instructors guide/aid. We have made great strives but still not ready for press. We are not sure how to market the ebooks. One for every rank? One for white to yellow, one for blue to red, one up to 1st Dan? Just one for 1st dan then the second one for 2nd and 3rd? The third for 4th and 5th? Then the last one 6th - up? We want to make money but also understand the need. Give us your feed back. :evil:
  9. doomx2001

    doomx2001 Valued Member

    Here is what I would like to see if I bought a book (or if I was marketing it) on higher grade Kuk Sool material.

    1. First, I think you should offer a free White to Yellow gup pdf or a combination of random pages from White to Black (about 15 to 20 pages) so that people can get an idea of quality of product.
    Many people are hesitant to spend money, but they will for a quality product, and by offering a free sample it will help encourage them to do so. And also, at the stage where your at, you can gauge peoples reaction and criticism of your product while you still have time to fix it.

    2. I say sell the chapters individually (White to Yellow for example), as some people might be tight on money, but also sell the chapters collectively from White to Black (per Dan, so that way you can focus on details). By selling the chapters individually (White to Yellow for example), you helping some students with their training, who might not be able to afford the whole book (and who might drop out of class in the future not even needing the rest of the chapters). For those hardcore enthusiast like me, I will be buying the whole book (First Dan book, Second Dan book...etc). Having both version I think will serve both needs well.

    3. I'm looking for quality. I would like to see your book go more indepth on the techniques/hyung. Lots of close-ups and details about the theories/concepts of the techniques/hyungs. Close-ups on pressure points.
    A good history chapter is a must. Not just the history according to KSW, but your own research, and documenting many of the KSW's (60's to Present) allumini who are with and no longer with the organization to preserve the history for future generations. (Examples: Everyone from In Hyuk Suh, In Sun Seo, Steve Seo, Barry Harmon to....Ken Duncan, Choon S. Yang, Chu Seup Ma, Jin Jon Moon...etc)
    Basically make your book everything a KSW book cannot be do to rules, pride, and regulations.

    4. For each chapter have a one page belt/rank requirement listing.

    5. Another Idea is to have White to Black belt be one entire book and 1st degree to 5th degree be a book on its own.

    6. I would like to see some comparisons with Chinese Mantis Kung Fu, Taiji Quan, Tiger Kung Fu, and Crane Kung Fu to help put KSW techniques in perspective.

    7. DETAIL CHAPTERS ABOUT ANIMAL TECHNIQUES!!! I can't find anything useful other than a few quick articles on Animal techniques in KSW. Most of which are quick reads, with little substance.

    8. Variations! I would like to see variations of KSW techniques to show different ways of doing the same old thing, and variations that may actually be improvements on some techniques. Anything to get the brain thinking creatively.

    To give you some inspiration, I recommend looking at Hap Ki Do: The Korean Art of Self Defense by: Hui Son Choe and Gyokko Ryû (Bujinkan Budô Densho by: Carsten Kuhn. Those two books can give you some good ideas about layout and overall design of your book.

    Anyway, I would like to get a copy/copies of your book. I look forward to reading it when your finished.

    - Brian/Doomx2001
  10. doomx2001

    doomx2001 Valued Member

    I actually typed a books worth of stuff, but for whatever reason, it is 'Pending Approval'.

    So anyway, I'll try again. :)

    Here is what I would like to see out of your book/books your writing:

    1. Free Sample. Why? Because 1. It gets people excited about your product and 2. From the feed back your getting, you will be able to adjust and improve the overall product. I recommend either doing a 10 page sample of White belt stuff or maybe a 15 page sample of excerpts from white to black.

    2. Offer 3 formats to download or purchase books, by giving people choice, you increase the chances of them purchasing your product:

    --------A. White to Black (1st Dan) and a book for each Dan grade

    --------B. Each chapter (white, yellow, orange....1st dan, 2nd dan...etc)
    -------- broken up into PDF's. This way, poor people can afford your book
    -------- chapter by chapter.

    --------C. Mega-Book. White to 9th degree black belt.

    3. Use Magcloud (or Lulu or Cafepress) printing services. You set up a user account, upload pdf, and anyone can download your book for a price or for free (your choice) and you can also sell a hardcopy that Magcloud will sell and ship for you for a fee.

    4. Detailed book. Close ups on techniques, details on theory, details on concepts, and show variations of techniques.

    5. History of Kuk Sool from 1950's to now. A good history on the development of Kuk Sool from the 50's to now. (Referring also to the days of Kuk Sool Hwe). Also, just as important, write about many well know current and former Kuk Sool Won practioners who founded their own styles: In Hyuk Suh (and his sons), In Sun Seo (and his sons), Barry Harmon, Marlin Sims, Ken Duncan, ....etc. Its important to preserve history as it happened and as it happens for future generations.

    Anyway, I recommend two books to help inspire you with the layout and design of your book. The first is a series of books by Carsten Kuhn (Gyoku Ryu, Kukishinden ryu, Shinden Fudo Ryu, Koto Ryu, Togakure Ryu...etc). These books are hand illistrated and easy to understand. Beautifully put together.
    The other books I recommend is those by Hui Son Choe. He is wrote about 3 Hapkido books. The photographs are easy to understand. Check Amazon for all the books I just mentioned. Check out the free previews to give yourself some inspiration.

    Sorry it took me so long to write this, but I was waiting on moderator approval for comment approval for whatever reason.

    - Brian
  11. Simon

    Simon Administrator Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    doomx2001, I've only just noticed your post needed approving. It's now done.

    Sorry for the delay.
  12. doomx2001

    doomx2001 Valued Member

    No problem brother. I figured it was just goofy message board thing, and besides, moderator or not, nobody can spend their life 24-7 behind a computer to keep up with this stuff, :) .

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