Some thoughts about tenaga dalam (internal strength)

UP or down, left or right, inwards or outwards, seen or unseen, internal or external, esoteric or exoteric…… either this or that and the same old argument about what is correct.

Most people would agree that a perfect human would be BALANCED but what does that mean in the context of this discussion?
Some people take the physical because it’s easy to understand and discard everything else as false whilst some reject the physical as unholy and seek to live in the clouds.
Both feet firmly on earth or head in the clouds, but why not one foot in the physical and the other in the spiritual. That reminds me in ancient times this would be explained with a particular posture which has the same meaning, perhaps you know it.

 

Narrue,

We have different posture to train our tenaga dalam of which I couldn't really say if they are that ancient. In fact we train our tenaga dalam also in our asli langkahs too by not stressing the explosiveness of the movement but performing them slowly, focussing on breathing and direction of energy in conjunction with the movement. More or less like doing it in a meditative manner...

Pekir

 

Pekir

I was not talking about a posture in which to do tenaga dalam training.
In ancient times postures and gestures had symbolic meanings behind them. There is a posture which means balance or the perfected human. The perfected human is balanced and balance only results when opposites are harmonised.
As I said some people stick to the physical and look outwards, others look to the spiritual and only look inwards but they are both extremes. One neglects his physical body and follows the spiritual path, the other neglects his higher functions and only has interest in the physical.
One seeks to perfect his outer self and the other seeks to perfect his inner self. The result is one develops a strong body (shell) but has no inner depth whilst the other has great inner depth but a week body (shell). Both believe they are following the correct path and looks down on the other but in reality they are both wrong. A balanced person looks up, down, inwards, outwards and in that way is complete.
A man can not live on bread (physical) alone but neither can he live on water (spiritual) alone, a smart man eats bread and drinks water.

What has this got to do with tenaga dalam? well some say it is to be found in the physical (posture) whilst others say it is to be found in the breath (prana). I would say eat bread and drink water if you want to be a strong boy

 

Eating bananas

Narrue said :
Some people take the physical because it’s easy to understand and discard everything else as false whilst some reject the physical as unholy and seek to live in the clouds.

As-Salamu 'alaykum Narrue & Pekir,
Everyone have their own way to understand that is true . I don't recall saying everything else that differed from my take was false though. In my view spirituality imbues everything I do ... we do. However when I'm concentrating on a mechanical problem, I need to focus on an answer which is grounded in my physical reality ... accepting that everything I am is because of Gusti Alah.

When I eat a banana, I do not rely on magik to get me through. I understand that there is an anatomical mechanistic solution to peeling the banana, guiding banana to open mouth, chewing banana 21 times and then swallowing. Then I know that my gut secretes digestive juices to further break down the banana so that my body can benefit from the vitamins and minerals that were part of said banana. I understand the problem from a mechanical physical reality and solve the problem the same way.

When I move or strike, I approach it the same way I eat a banana. My kebatinan is already part of who I am ... and I have no need to focus on it to solve problems grounded in a physical reality ... because it is always there.

Pekir said:
We have different posture to train our tenaga dalam of which I couldn't really say if they are that ancient. In fact we train our tenaga dalam also in our asli langkahs too by not stressing the explosiveness of the movement but performing them slowly, focussing on breathing and direction of energy in conjunction with the movement. More or less like doing it in a meditative manner...

It sounds similar ... have you actually read the thread?

Kind regards
KA

 

Kembang Alas

Tenaga dalam is equivalent to Qigong or pranayama. If you only believe in the physical then that is equivalent to practicing qigong but not believing in the existence of qi/chi or practicing pranayama but not believing in the existence of prana. As for eating a banana, I agree with everything you said about the process except I believe that all living things have prana and therefore I would say that along with the calorific energy you absorbed from the banana you also absorb prana from it.
I agree with everything you said about physical training and developing the core however I can’t agree that prana/chi does not enter into this so let’s just agree to disagree on this point.

 

What is prana? Life-force? What is Qi? The subliminal electrical current inherent in all living matter? Life force?

The truth is I don't know ... and please, I'm not saying it doesn't exist either!

We all create frames of reference to come to grips with our own realities. It is what I think of as a world view or a life view.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with your approach, you use the frames of reference of Qi and prana and that is fine too, however it would be misleading for me to describe what I know in that context because I only have a passing familiarity within the context of Qi and Prana.

Salam

 

I would not say I take Qi/Prana as my frame of reference but when talking about particular subjects such as Qigong, Pranayama or tenaga dalam I think it is something that should not be omitted as my qigong teacher always told me that that was the whole point of doing the exercise in the first place or at least a major part of it.
In my opinion taking Qi as your frame of reference is probably wrong as is taking a purely physical approach. I would imagine that both have equal importance.
To improve everything needs work, sad but true. (1) If you wanted to strengthen your physical body you need to do physical work. (2) If you want to strengthen your vital force then you need to do breathe work and posture exercises. (3) If you want to strengthen your mind/intellect then you need to read books, meditate, set your mind at solving problems.
We can see that different things are required to strengthen different aspects of the body, One is not more important then the other. They are all different and all important.

When talking about tenaga dalam I consider it to fall into category 2 and therefore I would say breath work and posture are the core requirements here, and yes that involves knowledge of prana/Qi.

Out of interest what is the Indonesian word for Qi or prana i.e. what do Indonesians call the vital force.

 

Rahayu Narrue,

You are welcome to your opinion, I have already stated what I think tenaga dalam is ... so I won't mbolak-mbalik (go back and forth) here.

My intention in this thread is to share what I know to be true for me, and that doesn't involve the concepts of prana and qi (honest ... trying to understand the complexity would only give me a headache! ).

However, I believe that by doing what I do, I achieve a high level of effectiveness ... and I get to test the results in the real world most days of the week ... and they aren't always drunk either . It is also the methodology I use to teach.

Why don't you start a new thread and elucidate all of us with your knowledge of Qi, Prana and the more esoteric side of energy work? Maybe you might be able to elucidate a dunce like me .

I know of prana in Indonesian as tenaga prana & Qi as tenaga ci ... my younger brother Bram (Kiai Carita) might know of a more appropriate asli boso Jowo word?

Salam

 

Kembang Alas,

I've read most of the thread, not all???

Regards,
Pekir

 

Kembang Alas

From reading the description of the type of exercises you do for tenaga dalam I would say you are already doing qigong type exercises, just perhaps you didn’t realise it. I would also say that it will have the same or similar results anyway so no need to start another thread.
It’s good to recognise the existence of such things anyway.