MMA, Krav Maga, Traditional Martial Arts And My Philosophy Of Martial Arts

One is proven to create fighters and the other gives something to do other than carry logs?

 

True this isn't an academic exercise but the sources of material may make a big difference on how credible their conclusions might be.

Years ago I was at a Jockey Assocation/FA meeting regarding head injuries. Concussions are not sport specific and we were looking at the differences in how concussions were dealt with in different sports/countries. The Aussie Rules people recognised that there appearred to be 2 different types on events going on. Some people were knocked out and when tested had no appreciable damage. More like a computer being re-set. Others you could see a definite number of clear signs that were even more clearly noticed on imaging and diagnositc testing. When you look at the research (at leaast historically) there hasn't been a recognition that different outcomes can occur with concussive events (short term).

Here is some info from the National Athleic Trainer's Association in the US. -

''Long-Term Consequences.

The relationship between concussion and long-term cognitive health is not clear. A
number of cross-sectional investigations 184–186 have shown no chronic changes in neurocognitive functioning after concussion in a young adult population. Others, however, have shown changes to neurocognitive functioning, 187,188 brain function, 189–191 neuroelectrical activity, 192–195 and motor control. 196,197 Yet none of these authors reported an association between the declines and clinical impairment.
Results of surveys 51–53,198 of former professional athletes, however, have suggested the potential for cumulative concussive and subconcussive impacts over an athlete’s
playing career to be associated with late-life cognitive iimpairment, depression, and chronic traumatic encephalopathy. Indeed, retired professional football players with a self-reported history of 3 or more concussions were 3 times more likely and those with a
history of 1 or 2 concussions were 1.5 times more likely to be diagnosed with depression than their peers who did not report concussions. 51 Similarly, a preliminary report 52 has
0 Volume 49 Number 2 April 2014associated retired professional football players who
sustained 3 or more concussions with mild cognitive impairment and self-reported significant memory impairments. Others 53,199,200 have speculated that exposure
to concussive and subconcussive impacts may lead to chronic traumatic encephalopathy, a progressive neurodegenerative disorder that results in a buildup of tau proteins in the brain. In large part, persons reporting clinical impairments thought to be associated with concussion are former professional athletes with a uniquely high level of exposure to contact and collision sports that may have been moderated by a number of other intrinsic (eg, genetic profile) and extrinsic (eg, lifestyle) factors. 201 In addition,
longitudinal research that can directly associate concussive and subconcussive impacts with cognitive health, while controlling for normal age-related declines and other
factors, has not been completed. As such, the relationship among concussion, subconcussive impacts, and long-term brain health is not clear. These studies are viewed as preliminary; additional research is needed to adequately address this association. ''

Journal of Athletic Training
2014;49(2):000–000
doi: 10.4085/1062-6050-49.1.07
Ó by the National Athletic Trainers’ Association, Inc
www.natajournals.org

So the question might be, does the amount of contact a MMA or other combative fighter amount to anything comparable to the level and number of hits one takes in contact sports where sever impacts are routinely occurring (look at a real of big hits for rugby, NFL or other high velocity sports). As others have said, you can potentially train safely with preparation but even if you do change your training method there is no guarantee that people might not develop simlar problems anyway (falls/throws in grappling producing concussive forces etc).

Another thing that might be a mitigating factor in MMA is whether there is a different end result when you combine routine los of conciousness (choked out) with repetitive cumulative head trauma. Nothing simple going on here! :' D

Just some thoughts and bit more info for the mix.

LFD

 

Do you know if grappling training (not competing), especially in regards to submissions, has an increased injury rate on joints?

i was wondering if joint stability might be compromised by the repeated pressure of subs to tapping point

 

I know that you get progressively more resistant to the pain, which may in turn lead to more injury as you can "grit your teeth" through some subs.

I find in my grappling I can work aroud injuries a lot better than my standup simply because you can work to degree easier

 

If your joints are getting Injured, your tapping point is too late.

 

I haven't seen anything on this and I doubt that there has been any realresearch in this area almost specifically since sub-grappling sports have not really been that main stream.

One thing I would say is that I am not sure I would come to the conclusion you are moving towards. If you put someone under anaesthesia their joints become exceptinallly supple. It shows that almost always that the muscular system is protecting the person even when you are sure that you are at the end of a movment. You can do hold relax to strech out a person's knee to the point of ''a sub'' and yet under anaesthia you would see another 15 degree's of movement.

Can things get too lax over time? Well again you develop a ''set point'' which your nervous system is comfortable with. If you play guitar you get used to stretching your fingers backwards to the point that would be painful for most people but that doesn't lead to damaged fingers, just that you have a bit more mobility than those who do not use the available range. Still if you had the joint ''forced'' enough times you could get cumulative damage. I'm just not sure whether this would be the case for most people or not. It depends on whether pain or damage is what stops people. When I ruptured my posterior cruciate I felt no pain at all and that is probably the biggest/toughest ligamaent in the body.... (I might have been partially in shock but didn't seem to affect me at the time )

Any of that make any sense?

LFD

 

As I've already stated I think people should be able to do what they want. I think the worst thing to do would be prohibit MMA. I'm not against MMA.

 

Most of this is my opinion. I studied traditional martial arts for over six years, that's how I know they are bogus. MMA is a proven martial system that requires people to actually demonstrate their skills in as close to real environment as possible. I think that self defence and law enforcement training should emulate this.

 

Great post. I agree with your assessment.

 

this is going to be fun.

 

Yeah I better qaulify what I mean by traditional martial arts. In my opinion a tradional martial art is a martial art that focuses on forms or kata often completely lacking any competative or live contact training. Traditional shoalin kung fu is a good example.

 

In TMA terms after six years you are not even out of training pants

 

Which is one of the reasons why TMA is not effective. You'd learn more about fighting by doing boxing for six months than doing TMA for six years.

 

[intentionally facetious] gee, and here i though my first sensei did it right by having us spar and do partner drills with contact right from white belt .

*tears clothes* my whole life was a lieeeeeee... [\intentionally facetious]

 

Well then what exactly is your point?

 

Well you would learn more about boxing certainly, but what are you defining as a TMA?

BJJ is traditional, so is Judo and wrestling is the oldest martial art there is. So what are you using as a parameter?

 

Go a few posts back and you will see.

 

Your definition is myopic

 

What would you call martial art like shoalin kung fu?

 

Not what I meant by myopic