Macho men...

No, you're not. We've had students who have needed a good lecture on self-control and what "tapping out" means.

Look, if you're in the ring competing, it's one thing. I can't stand people who choose to compete and then cry when they get hit. It's what you're there for. But when you're in class working, a line has to be drawn. Yes, conditioning is important, and no, you shouldn't cry like a child every time someone touches you. But you also shouldn't be subjected to the not-so-gentle ministrations of some meathead who decides that he's going to ignore when you tap out or call "break".

 

Wow, missed that one: When someone taps you release as soon as you notice the tap (gigantic period) end of story. Anyone who cannot handle this concept needs to find a new and hopefully less harmful activity. If the club actually supports that kind of attitude get out as quick as you can, let someone else be the one that files the lawsuit that shuts them down permanently.

 

I agree; if someone taps - even if you think the lock's not on that tight and they're being a wuss - you release the pressure. Telling someone to "suck it up" and cranking it is stupid and dangerous. Imagine what would happen if people had that attitude to heel hooks

 

If you're talking about working in class, then I'm 100% disagreeing with you. If you strike your classmate hard enough to cause a limp, then that's it, done. Students shouldn't be subjected to those kinds of injuries in class. I don't buy into the whole "well, he didn't call break". Sorry, but I've seen too many dumb guys who are afraid to "look weak" and want to try to fight through an injury which really needs to be tended to, and that's how they get injured worse. AFAIC, more mature students need to watch the less mature students to ensure that they don't get so injured they can't train for a week or two because they were too dumb to realize they were hurt.

There is a difference between the tough guy who fights through a minor injury and the idiot who can't stand but is to dumb to tap.

 

Not allowed to show pain in my Muay Thai training, just another thing to learn I guess. My Mum does Muay Thai and laughs when she gets tagged, the harder she is hit the more she laughs - weird

 

I was refering to actual competitions not day to day training.

 

Actually the person who did that deserves a lesson in pain (if they don't show pain early, all the better) and most likely a lawsuit, since he or she deliberately inflicted serious physical damage in direct violation of the safety rules of training.

As for showing pain, most men will tend to not show pain:

a) in the presence of females, unless it makes them look even more macho.
b) to themselves, especially in a fight setting. We feel the pain after the fight is over, literally. To a lesser extent this also applies in training.
c) to their opponent. This is because a fight is fought at the attitude (mostly confidence) level as well as the physical, and if the opponent knows that he has hurt you it is a big plus for him, if you get your nose pasted sideways and don't even blink, that will scare him.

Having thought about this myself, i realise that sometimes (in training, never in sparring) i do show pain, a bit more exaggerated that it actually is. I find that this helps me deal with it and get back to training.

 

yeahhhh...

every man feels pain even if they dont show it... once your in that fighting and training mode your focused and dedicated. i guess when most men train theyre
focused so much that they dont seem to feel pain. were idealists we focus on
an image of who we think we should be... and appearing to feel no pain is sometimes one of them.


-j

 

You should have said that, I hate wasting a good rant!

 

i'll tell my sensei if i am in so much pain or discomfort that i can no longer perform what i am asked....there have been times when i kicked someone and jammed my toe, it hurt, but i walked it off, my partner gave me the time i needed and then i continued,....however, there was one time when i went to go grap my partners arm and i jammed my thumb so bad that it snappend back and tore tendons and ligaments and broke my thumb...right when it happened my whole hand went numb and my thumb swelled up to the size of a cucumber *exaggeration*, i told my sensei, i left class and went to the hospital to get a cast put on....so i do work threw the pain until if forces me to stop

 

Lily, the guys in your class must be rather young..... at least younger than 35.

All I can say is that in our adult class, where the approx age of the adult men is 35-40 .... you can literally hear hips & shoulders popping and continuous moans & groans ... and this is just during stretching!!

.... you need ear muffs when sparring to muffle the agonizing screams of pain!!! !

Real men show their pain

 

Hey! I only "creek" and pop when I'm at home! <where's my cane?> :yeleyes:

 

i think guys pretty much acknowledge what hurts, but the fact that everyone else has a stone cold expression on there face getting blasted in jkd, every guy puts on this expression.

 

But you're so pretty when you're angry. :love:

 

KickChick - too funny! We actually have a good spread of ages from 18 - 50 in our class. The older guys may be out of breath a little quicker than the others but have great endurance and mental strength.

Ap Oweyn - sorry to sound whiney Its just that during sparring when I land a hit most of the guys just get more poker faced on me. I guess it psyches me out. But I'm learning from them! As many of you have said its partly physical, partly psychological and a learned behaviour not to show weakness to an opponent.

I've been doing cold water dowsing long before I started MA so not sure if it has helped me in anyway. Thanks for the link!

The guy who told me to 'suck it up'...he has a reputation for being an unsafe partner (the only one at our dojo). I don't work with him anymore though I have given him countless chances and spoken to him nicely about it. He's not a nasty person, just has moments of stupidity where he feels he must show off by cranking on a lock, throwing heat-seeker punches, trying out techniques on lower grades they are not prepared for etc. Sensei has spoken to him quite a few times and pairs him up with the experienced guys. I feel sorry for him after classes as he sits alone outside and wonders why people have gone hard against him (he can dish it but can't take it).

 

You don't sound whiney Lily. I hope I didn't suggest otherwise. I just think it's useful to figure out why something's important (i.e., their reaction to pain versus yours). And there could be perfectly good reasons why it IS important. You already hit on at least one. That it offers them a psychological advantage, or "psych out", that you don't have. I think that's a good point. So now you've answered part of the question.

Does that make sense? It was one of those terribly pretentious questions designed to get you to be all introspective. It probably wasn't very graceful of me, but there you go. I'm a big, clumsy introspection encourager.

 

I gotta say I know what you mean. For a long time I was the only female in my class and I personally felt it would make them treat me even more differently had I behaved like a wuss when I got hurt. I was able to suck it up those days - but due to a very long time out of training I am a wuss now. Just as well I am going back to training I guess... lol

 

Good story for you girls. My sensei could not make it to take a seminar so he asked me to take it. In a future newsletter students complained that sensei Coyle had been too severe in the training. When my teacher asked me what I had done I had to admit. I could not make the seminar so had sent my DAUGHTER a second dan at the time to take it for me!!!!!
Her nickname was "sorry" because she had to apologise after a lot of her techniques!!
Incidently I am her father not her mother.So ladies be natural as my wife keeps reminding me any woman who wants to be equal to men lacks ambition!!!

Koyo

 

Koyo you must be proud of your daughter!

Ap Oweyn - I'm amazed at how the answer is unfolding in my mind. I've been held back by myself (especially in my jjj) and it took your question to get me started on the process of working through this. I will definitely work on moving past what others feel and work on myself...its a positive mental shift

Melanie - good luck getting back into training. Tell us how it goes.

 

While it might seem unsettling at first, I think it's pretty normal if the guys aren't screaming in agony after being hit.

Personally, I usually smile. I love being hit; it validates the training.