Macho men...

I'm not sure if the guys at my dojo are some sort of freaky macho maniacs but they never show pain and rarely communicate the fact that they are sore, hurt, in pain etc.

I consider myself very fit/athletic but the throws, falls, drills, sparring do take a toll on my body. The handful of girls at my dojo are the same and at times we will complain to each other, discuss our injuries, wince or get teary.

My question is do you feel pain during class and if so do you do anything about it (eg. cry, complain, put on a brave front, fight harder)?

I would just feel better if the guys showed some weakness :woo:

 

macho macho man! I want to be...a macho man!

No I never feel pain from being thrown to the ground a dozen or so times. Being half choked out several times and having my arms and legs overextended many times each class. I feel perfectly fine.

Guys don't show pain to women or each other. Women say they want to see a man cry and once he does, they don't respect him.

 

I think people should admit when they're in pain, I know I do! It's a really bad idea to be too macho about it because taking the knocks is one thing but serious injury is another. This is why I stopped going to the judo club I went to - in only a few lessons I picked up two serious injuries, and both times I was told I was alright to carry on when I blatantly wasn't and made it worse.

 

Yep. We've all seen it happen. lol

 

Most men feel pain less sharply than women; that's a simple fact. Of course, there are exception, but our skin is often thicker, less sensitive. That might explain part of it.

But from the moment we are born, we are traditionally taught to shrug pain off. Not being able to do so would be seen as a failure. It's not always about being macho or trying to impress the ladies, but one of the core values taught to most men.

IMHO, it's neither good nor bad; it just is. Just like when women can't go out without make-up and other "preparation". For the same reason it is expected of a women to make an effort and try to look good (even if many men will claim they prefer when women look natural), it is expected of a man to be tough (even if many women claim they want a sensitive man).

 

At my old Dojo the idea was if you got into a real fight it was no a good idea to broadcast the fact that you were hurt to an attacker if you were in fact hurt.

On the other hand someone who refused to tap out when I had them in a RNC because they were being hypermacho nearly lost consciousness.

 

We feel pain just like anyone else, but its the threshold of pain that differ between men and women. Sometimes men have higher thresholds, sometimes the women do
Heck, I feel the pain now after all the years of taking the hard falls, throws, hits

 

putting aside pain and being macho are two different things...macho is when you have someone in a submission and they refuse to tap until you crank it as far as it'll possibly go without breaking. that's annoying.

putting aside pain is just expected, because nobody wants to hear about your bumps and bruises while there's still work to be done. what's the point in complaining about things like that anyway? it's not like telling other people about it will make it go away, so you may as well just accept it.

 

I agree think men do feel pain less then women, or at least that is how they are conditioned to act.

Also i think it depends on experience level, the more experienced you are the more you deal with ow to handle pain and also you know your techniques better so are less likely to get hurt. e.g. a correct breakfall can stop you feeling alot of pain!

TOm

 

Part of MA is learning to take a punch; realising that one of the weapons you have is that somebody can really give you a good thump, and you can turn around and get them right back.
We even do an exercise where you stand in kiba-dachi arms outstretched, and your partner slaps and thumps you for a minute or so.
I am constantly in pain in at least one or two places at any given time, and try not to whinge about it.
If somebody hurts me bad or injures me, I'll say so.
If I have an injury that will prevent me being able to train effectively, I will say so.
But general knocks and bumps are part of the game - enjoy them!

(OTOH, Sensei did once demonstrate a thigh kick on me, and I said "Ow!", which was a bit wimpish, TBH.)

 

You've all got valid points and glad to hear some of you'll can admit feeling 'pain', its just that sometimes its hard to figure out if my dojo mates are just 'putting aside the pain' and going on, don't feel the pain as much or are being macho.

TimmyBoy - you're so right. Despite tapping three times when I was put in a lock a few months ago the person putting the lock told me to 'suck it up' and proceeded to put his whole weight and yank me, I tore a muscle.

We have a lot of guys who don't come to class regularly and I suspect its because they're carrying an injury but they never say so. I never miss a class no matter what condition I'm in (pretty much all the girls seem to) so I'm not sure what that says

 

How would it change your training experience if you knew that your male classmates were in pain? I'm not trying to be a wisearse. But I'm curious why it matters whether they cop to being in pain or no. Sounds like you're both going through the same curriculum. And you're doing what you need to do (i.e., share your feelings on being hurt) with some classmates. That strategy seems to work for you. So how would knowing change things?


Stuart

 

You should've parked your car on his foot then walked off, telling him to "suck it up".

:woo:

 

Women have a high pain threshold because they have babies, a friend I knew who did tattoo's said that women were easier to tattoo then men because of what I have just said.

Women are expected to cry and show pain bla bla, but I know many who don't. I did get shocked from being kicked in the face but I carried on, some men feel a little weak if they show they are hurt. The men at my class show pain and tears because its human.

Nothing wrong with showing true emotion we are not robots.

Tans

 

As my Sifu likes to say "If you take up Martial Arts, something will always be hurting". I was in class last night. Worked really hard on increasing my flexibility and my hamstring is letting me know that I pushed. My right knee is a bit sore too. 2 Weeks ago I pulled or tore my left calf muscle. I was kicking a handheld target and felt it pop. My partner, female, said my face changed to a look of "what just happened?". I did not yell or scream or even say ouch. Not because of some macho Bull Shirt, but because it would not do any good. Sitting down, putting an Ice Pack on it would.

 

yeah i get my hit hard every training session, i always leave with bruises... it does hurt but im not really one to cry/sook about things. I didn't take up muay thai just to dance around like a ballerina...
pain is part of any sport, it just shows that you're trying to push yourself, so what if you have a bruise the next day, there's worse things in life.

 

Well... being a massochist, pain really doesn't bother me all that much.. I mean you have to be of a certain irregular mindset to take up martial arts to begin with.. So I get immense amounts of enjoyment doing forearm and shin conditioning. If I get hit in the face in class by a junior or senior student I kind of just shrug it off and chalk it up to the training. I mean if you can't take the pain in a controlled setting... what makes you think you'd be able to take it when the fecal material hits the fan?

Then again there is a certain sadistical part of me that really enjoys watching my training partner wince when doing paired limb conditioning. Makes me push that much harder.. Besides they'll thank me later for pushing them that much harder, even though at the moment they're rubbing their shins/forearms in an attempt to stop the short term pain.

 

In some cases it's a matter of fight conditioning: Guys learn very early that showing vulnerability invites further attack. If you've competed in any fight sport you will see the tactic used. For example, Kalib's ribs on this seasons Ultimate Fighter, Kendall knew he hurt his ribs so he continued to attack the body on that side until Kalib gave up.

If I land a couple good leg shots and I notice my opponent is limping then it's time to work the leg till he goes down. The result of participating in something like this is that you learn to not show signs of injury.

However, in Jujutsu if I'm caught and unable to escape, I tap, especially if it's a kneebar or any ankle lock, I'm not waiting for the pain, if the hold is sunk in I'm tapping and screaming like a little girl in case they didn't notice the tap . I'm too old to risk those types of injuries.

 

A good way to increase pain tolerance is with cold water dowsing.

Basically, every time you have a shower, at the end whack it on as cold as it can go. What will happen is you will start to hyperventilate and breath with your upper chest, this is normal. What you should try to do is to calm your breathing, and bring it down, preferably to you abdomen. If you can do this, you will notice that the cold really has little effect on you and the majority of the shock is due to you breath and expectation. If you practice this, it will in turn carry though to your MA training.

Humans have a reaction to tense up when they get hit. Tense muscles don’t redistribute the shock well, this reaction localises the shock from the strike in to one small area causing pain, winding, etc. If you can relax when you get hit, the effect is decreased as the shock is distributed through your body. This may seem counterintuitive, but it works well. Also, make sure you breath out when you get hit, especially if your being hit in the abdomen. After a while this will become instinctive. Make sure you let go of the fear of being hit as well, and trust in this technique.

An example of this sort of process in the real world is drunks, they often fall but rarely hurt themselves, the reason being they are loose and relaxed. Similar effect with some drug addicts. Animals, also behave in such a way, apes and monkeys often fall out of tall trees with little negative effect on their structures. Cats get kicked by morons, and walk away like nothings happened., etc, etc.

There are also some health benefits to the cold water dowsing practice, you can read up on these in the “Cold Water Dowsing” thread, I think it was in the health and fitness section somewhere. One member on here, tried this out and reported that it even got rid of his migraines.

Also, you may find this interesting:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/4641567.stm

Enjoy!

 

Am I the only one that thinks this is a pretty significant offense when training? I'm pretty sure that anybody who did this in our school would be expelled. We did have someone suffer a dislocated ankle recently, but that's because she didn't tap out.

Really, if everytime we train we are going to take our locks to the end no matter what, there won't be much of a class left to practice with (or pay tuition).