1/ Definitely not a formal environment, I practice alone, or with whomever comes to hand. 2/ I think I started studying LG after Black. During training LG I was training other things anyway, so no simple answer there. I 'focussed' on WC for a while, to get specific answers, and now I'm onto other things. 3/ I'm not interested in formalised practice of anything. Or rather, I may be, when my thoughts take a pure enough form. It's alway been about using everything I know, rather than being limited in practice by the thoughts of others/systems. Don't want to say to much, as this is a LG topic, and your questions are about me specifically. Off on the road, see you in a week!
Sub Zero, (and others) as to the forms and forms competition thing, all I can say is I have my opinion which others share, regarding what is considered traditional and what is not. Thats it really. What I could never understand, is why 30 years ago, Jeremy Yau Sifu, didnt simply name his system 'Yau Gar'.
Wow, you guys are prolific posters. I can't keep up. Anyway... Thanks for the invitation. It's appreciated. Given the seriousness and sincerity expressed here I wouldn't be surprised at all.
Going back to paul s posting, you need to know the origin of the lau gar fist form hung gar it,s proberly newer than the lau gar forms from jeremy yau by adding to the end of lau gar syllbus your not making it anymore lau gar
Just felt like adding a thumbs up for the overall posting in the thread. I even feel better informed about Lau Gar now... kudos to all involved. And welcome to MAP makarov!
Just a quick reply to Dirty Cat I think I know what you refer to - the recent debate elsewhere that Hung Gar's "Lau Gar Kuen" form is actually from Mok Gar and Lau Gar staff is actually from Southern Mantis. They were named "Lau Gar" after the name of the person (surname Lau) that showed them to the Lam family. The forms were tweaked to give them more of a Hung flavour. In any event there are 3 avenues open to you at our classes 1) Lau Gar only 2) Hung Gar only 3) study both (in separate classes) If you have ever studied both systems you will appeciate that Hung Gar demands significant endurance, conditioning and a certain attitude (Gung Gee Fook Fu alone contains hundreds of movements and takes about 7 minutes from start to finish if done at a standard pace). This isn't for everyone (some people just don't want to go down that road) and is considerably different from Lau Gar which has relatively short forms. I'm not saying that UK Lau Gar is less of a system than Hung Gar or doesn't demand commitment - just that the emphasis is placed on different aspects of training and that many people might not be up for the Hung Gar approach. (Although it is actually very popular at our classes) Some students have spent many years doing Lau Gar style and will, in the longer term, learn more Hung Gar. HG's LGK therefore provides a means of transitioning from Lau Gar to Hung Gar. Some may not want to get into Hung Gar at all and at least can gain some of the key principles of Hung Gar by practicing HG's Lau Gar Kuen. This can only benefit them. This form's incorporation is therefore not intended to make what we do any more "Lau". If anything it's to make it more "Hung". I know that was a bit confusing..... Paul
Hi all, this is my first post and as I've only been doing Lau Gar a few months it's been extremely interesting, even useful, reading this discussion. For what my opinion is worth, having done Wing Chun before, Lau Gar seems very 'Western' if you get my point. The T-Shirts and Uniform with LAU GAR plastered everywhere does seem to take away the 'traditional' asspect of it all and some of the points raised in this discussion made me sit up and think that maybe I should choose another Martial Art; a more 'traditional' Martial Art that didn't have so much controversy! But after reflection my main thought was what do I want from it? Fitness and a chance to meet like-minded people came to mind. And secondly I enjoy it more than anything! Great forum and looking forward to reading plenty more discussions! Oh and my teachers are Graham and Adrian Abdullah so, as mentioned earlier, at least I'm in good hands!
I never met Adrian, but both he and Graham had a fearsome reputation as competitors back in the 80's/90's. Grahams forms work was superb.
hi,did not know people got so worked up about lau gar.lol we teach lau gar in scotland under sifu steve newby & master yau. we also teach lau kickboxing & gee wai shu . we follow the syllabus that master yau teaches,we go to birmingham as much as possible & steve comes back to scotland every month to teach the instructors. i enjoy doing lau gar & also teaching, we take up sports to enjoy them & get fit/win comps etc so if you are enjoying what you do then cool we do have problems within the style of break away instructors & i do think its unfair for them to call themselves lau gar but that is up to them. we have people calling all the time to ask who we affiliate with, can we prove we are instructors etc & all i can say is that we do what we need to do to make sure we have all the quilifications that are needed, we are doing nvq's also. look forward to more interesting talks soon
can i just say that the lau gar/sjn t shirts ect is so that people know who we are & what we train,free ads so to speak lol
T-shirts etc........... Hi, I don't really like the t-stirts etc with LAU GAR plastered over them either. But you don't have to wear these surely? We can get shirts from Sifu, usually the ones with Chinese LGK and the dragon on it. This has been designated the unoffical club kit, with black KF trousers. I suppose when you look at it, we have the style name in chinese, but in China/HK etc they have t-shirts and suits with their style on them in chinese too. So really putting the name in English makes sense. Personally I prefer the ones we wear. Of course if we want to then a mandarin suit is OK too. Dave.
Wow, thanks for bringing this one out of the vaults fizz_lau and blue sash, I had no idea about any of this stuff!
my 2 cents I have trained in martial arts for some 20 years... I began with Kyokushinkai karate, and reached 1st kyu (brown) before moving over to a Freestlye Karate system where I attained 1st dan. I then moved to Lau Gar and have practiced and taught this for some many years now and currenlty hold black sash grades in both the traditional (3rd ) and Kickboxing(3rd) sylabus. Originaly I was part of the BKFA and went through a transition when my sifu broke away (not scotland) from them and went solo eventually to create his own association. He had 25 years of traditional lau gar under his belt and was very competant. We were as many Lau Gar schools are competativly active. However he was adamant that traditional Kungfu was the foundation to build all on, and the competative side came from the traditional and did not become the be all and end all. Many of the top fighters in the country are LAU GAR fighters, from the early days with Steve Babs and Neville Wray to fighters such as Sean Viera, Curtis page and Nathan Lewis..not to forget Sharon Gill. All of these have won world titles in semi or continous fighting but still study traditional kung fu. My point is that a stlye is as good as who teaches it and who practices it. Good sifu's and bad can come from many different styles. Would you like a good sifu from a newer style or a bad sifu from a long lasting style. the answer is you want BOTH, good style and good Sifu. FINAL NOTE Just becasue you no longer are affiliated to a certain association does not mean that the stlye you learned and now teach is not Lau Gar. You dont forget your style just because you change associations. Associations are organisations in place to support ..not to define the style itself. Lau Gar is a strong system if taught by a good sifu and learned by a dedicated student...
Old thread new lau gar Can some one enlighten me on the history as this seems to be glossed over People say that there is lau gar uk is different to lau gar I suppose china does any one really know and if so what is the chinese version? this is what I have found some where {http://www.karatekorner.com/messageboard/viewmessages.cfm?Forum=6&Topic=2295&srow=11&erow=20} Quote: Well I've already been in touch with the Beijing University of MA, who found nothing, so don't bust a gut. The largely unspoken consensus, is that Master Yau invented the whole UK Lau Gar thing in 1974, but the UK press has been stifled (he has shares in some of the publications). Unquote is this true I am just intrested thats all
Somebodies opened the worm can!!! Hey old man, I'll try and give as accurate as possible account of this tale. I would like to say that this is my interpretation of the story and not the "OFFICIAL" line. Master Yau came here in about 1965 (i think). He worked in various jobs, including I believe a chinese resturant. During this time he did not really teach, but practiced either solo or with one or two others. More and more people started to get interested and the numbers slowly grew. Then in 1973 Mike Haig (editor & founder of "Combat Magazine")and several of Master Yau's students thought it a good idea to formalise their training by asking Master Yau to setup the British Kung Fu Association. This he did so, and with a group of his most senior students started to structure and create a more formal system. They took the training methods and the forms Master Yau taught and created the syllabus roughly as we know it today. The arm & leg blocks that are part of the syllabus, were derived directly from the forms. So.........the BKFA and the grading syllabus were "created" in the UK. However all the forms and the training methods were taught unchanged from what was taught to Master Yau by his grandfather. There is an old article written by Bey Logan ( currently in Hong Kong ) saying that Master Yau "invented" the system in his kitchen! The system was NOT invented in the UK, but standardised in the UK for the benefit of western students. The grading system was layed done at this time. As mentioned earlier, the system was split into 2 black sash grades, this was expanded over the years as there was a large amount of forms (weapons) for the 2nd degree. So........this was expanded to 3 blacks, then finally to 6 levels. This makes it much easier for practitioners to gauge their development. Any of you that have trained in the system know that the idea of a man with little martial arts knowledge invented the whole system in his kitchen, must realise that this is simply rediculous! In answer to the question from Ninestep, as to why Master Yau did not call the system Yau Gar: I asked Master Yau this question and he told me that his grandfather called the system he learnt Lau Gar Kuin, so obviously he continued to use the same name. I hope this clears up some points, and maybe raises some others! Colin.................
TC Phew I knew I could count on you I have been hearing some terrable S*it about this and I knew it could not be true. I guess when you are this good, people just want to bring you down. The names you said Mike Haig does sound true along with bey logan I guess you shouldnt believe what you read all the time. I must admit where I heard this was from another style (no names but it doesent even come close to the hard traing that lau gar does) but thanks for putting the record straight about this but on a lighter note is there lau gar out side the uk or is this a dying art in the rest of the world
Great post Tseek, clarifies one or two things. Oldman, I think you will find a lot of posts about this subject on various forums are posted by the same person who possibly has their own agenda
