Jumped and mugged last night - Random reflections

Discussion in 'Self Defence' started by Southpaw535, Nov 4, 2018.

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  1. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    Punching your girlfriend doesn't constitute "winning a fight". :)
     
    Smitfire, Sep 26, 2019
    #121
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  2. Grond

    Grond Valued Member

    I get that you believe that, but please show me where Marc said that. I don't believe he's saying what you're trying to argue.

    Keep in mind the context of this thread is multiple attackers, and not just taking strikes needlessly, but using your training to defend yourself and possibly escape, where offensive options are limited.

    Them. Down. Now?
     
    Grond, Sep 26, 2019
    #122
  3. Grond

    Grond Valued Member

    Oh....you...

    *Grond stomps off, tummy grumbling, to make himself some lunch.*
     
    Grond, Sep 26, 2019
    #123
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  4. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Renzo isn't GJJ, he's old school BJJ, so it covers all 4 areas MMA/NoGi/YesGi and self defence.
    GJJ is only used by one branch of the family.
    And the GJJ guys do a lot of SD and MMA work anyway, I regularly train with an ex GA guy, he's really good.

    Ralph's assaulting someone is here:

    https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=06wqRvN0Kdo&ved=2ahUKEwjendOh5u7kAhVnQkEAHW_jB_cQwqsBMAB6BAgFEAQ&usg=AOvVaw3QpsxpstfCtEF8aXEvzdVS&cshid=1569511604344
     
    Dead_pool, Sep 26, 2019
    #124
  5. Mitch

    Mitch Lord Mitch of MAP Admin

    If they are in genuine fear of being attacked, not just already under attack :)
     
    Mitch, Sep 26, 2019
    #125
  6. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    Ah yeah...you got me...I missed the end of the aphorism off...it should read...

    Him. Down. Now..............unless there's a couple of them....in which case take your time, trust in your toughness and hope they get tired of punching you.
     
    Smitfire, Sep 26, 2019
    #126
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  7. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    To be fair Marc is amazingly unbelivable, if he told me it was raining and still have to go outside to check.

    I think it's the 80's tastic fear based titles and the fact he looks like a biker hanger on.

    Which means I'm literally judging the book by it's cover!
     
    Dead_pool, Sep 26, 2019
    #127
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  8. bassai

    bassai onwards and upwards ! Moderator Supporter

    I’d just like to point out as you seem to have written him off as “just another sd book writer” Geoff Thompson is a hugely experienced doorman who worked some of the roughest areas in the midlands through the 80s and 90s and has probably had more street fights (including multiples) than the rest of this board put together , I tend to take his advise quite seriously.
     
    bassai, Sep 26, 2019
    #128
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  9. Grond

    Grond Valued Member

    Ah the timeless "I'm a bouncer, we fight good" fallacy. Most bouncers probably can't fight, they're not even there to fight. And plenty end up in the ER when they try. I laugh whenever people use bouncing as an appeal to authority, because I know their look and bark is a lot more important than their bite. Life isn't Road House.

    I know who Geoff Thompson is and I'm not writing him off but his experience is limited to him. I'm saying that when it comes to being physically assaulted especially by more than one person, I'm gonna go with Floyd Mayweather Sr's advice on how to defend myself, because you've seen it work time and time again. And what is Geoff's "fence" other than a kind of boxing guard.

    The Philly/turtle shell has protected people from some of the most vicious punches ever recorded on film. And it works against hooligans too.

    The best part is Southpaw already described this exact concept. No de-escalation. No possible retreat. No "him down now". He's exemplifying the same thing I am talking about. So, maybe it's not such bad advice and all that. Otherwise some of you are going to give him a complex and he might second guess himself forever, a bad thing.

    Southpaw did it right. He didn't stop fighting. He didn't escalate things further. He didn't get seriously hurt. He didn't seriously hurt anyone else.

    That's 4-0 in my book.
     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2019
    Grond, Sep 26, 2019
    #129
  10. Grond

    Grond Valued Member

    Don't punches tire you out? Maybe I'm getting old but I can't go more than about 5m on the bag without taking a nap.
     
    Grond, Sep 26, 2019
    #130
  11. bassai

    bassai onwards and upwards ! Moderator Supporter

    You do understand that you’re the only person here implying that anybody thinks Southpaw did anything wrong ?
    As far as I can see he did what was necessary to survive , and as I read the account he certainly didn’t “take a beating” or “wear his scars like medals”
    Look , I’m prepared to see this as a difference in culture as I believe gun crime is far more of a danger in the US , but here in the UK the danger of the random toe rag attacking you to be holding a something like a screwdriver is just too great to advocate allowing an adversary to wear themselves out is foolish. The attributes behind that plan , being used to taking a good hit , good fitness and mental fortitude are all great things , but to suggest you shouldn’t look to strike back , not so.

    You should stop trying to keep score on things that are meaningless , it’s not healthy
     
    bassai, Sep 26, 2019
    #131
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  12. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Gronds comprehension of pub violence in the 1980's in Coventry.... Be like...




    From what you've said,y really don't know Geoff's work, I don't know why your pretending otherwise.

    Criticising him Vs boxing is insane, he was one of the first martial artist who was pro boxing cross training, he's was a fully qualified boxing coach, his students were of some of the first vale tudo competitions in the UK, and winning!
     
    Dead_pool, Sep 26, 2019
    #132
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  13. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    As far as I can make out, both of you are right, in a way.

    Covering, evading, maybe getting a few off-putting-but-not-devastating strikes in is about as good as you can hope for if violence is not a regular occurrence your life.

    That doesn't mean that pre-emptive striking is bad advice. It comes from the experience of having people try to batter you on a regular basis and needing to nip it in the bud before your luck runs out.

    I agree that being a door supervisor/bouncer doesn't make you an authority, but in the right (or wrong) place it can give you a lot of experience of violence, which does confer some authority. The people I've known who have faced regular violence also ended up at the same conclusion: the surest way to survive violence is to do it first.
     
    David Harrison, Sep 26, 2019
    #133
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  14. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    I don't think I've read a single interview with him where he didn't say that Western boxing is the preferred core system to have for SD.
     
    David Harrison, Sep 26, 2019
    #134
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  15. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award



    This stuff was ground breaking in its time, this was pre UFC.
     
    Dead_pool, Sep 26, 2019
    #135
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  16. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    Geoff T had another good SD aphorism...learn to hit * hard.

    *insert a suitable word here. .like "really" for example...or "very".

    Its a very strange world where Floyd Mayweather Snr is seen as a better authority on the practicalities of self defence than Geoff T.
    The guy literally wrote the book/s on it.
     
    Smitfire, Sep 26, 2019
    #136
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  17. Southpaw535

    Southpaw535 Well-Known Member Moderator Supporter

    I don't really have anything to add other than being somewhat flattered at 4 pages of arguing about my actions, or lack thereof :p

    Although, I am curious. This has turned into a wider debate about SD training/coaches/whatever, but at its core is an interesting debate about best approach, with a practical example as a case study.

    Would anyone have recommended I handled things differently? I had the opportunity to potentially drop one of them with a groin shot, I thought about it, and decided against it weighing that in a multiple attack scenario my chances of then being able to put everyone else out were basically non-existent, and all I will have done is given them a very good reason to hospitalise me rather than stop at what I would still deem relatively 'social' violence.

    Would others have taken a different route? Perhaps taken that chance rather than risk a continued assault with unknown variables?

    I'm good with what I did. I have no illusions about who I am or what I'm capable of, I'll freely admit to being a wimp who would be scared to be in that situation again and try anything different. I say that not from a self pity point of view, but to establish I'm comfortable with my response and am genuinely curious about an honest answer to what else others my have recommended given the discussion that's occurred the last few pages? I'm more than happy to hear feedback and suggestions that are different to what I did and I'm not going to take any offence or have any questions of my own self worth or whatever if they're different. I just think its an interesting discussion to be had
     
    Southpaw535, Sep 27, 2019
    #137
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  18. Grond

    Grond Valued Member

    Am I? Really?

    Then why all the hubbub?
     
    Grond, Sep 27, 2019
    #138
  19. Grond

    Grond Valued Member

    Nope. You handled yourself admirably.
     
    Grond, Sep 27, 2019
    #139
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  20. bassai

    bassai onwards and upwards ! Moderator Supporter

    The thing , at least for me , is there’s no hard and fast rules about what to do in a self defence situation , only what I would consider “best practices”
    You did what you had to in what is pretty much the worst situation you could have found yourself in and walked away relatively unharmed , to me , that’s a win.
    To suggest you should have done anything else would just be armchair quarterbacking.
     
    bassai, Sep 27, 2019
    #140
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