Interesting thread, from someone who knows very little (really nothing) about tai chi I learn alot from reading these "discussions" I think you all really nead f.q'S input to keep the thread running though
My favourite movie taiji moment was in Ang Lee's Pushing Hands where it takes a whole squad of cops to get a little old guy to move. Then there's Drunken Tai Chi with Donnie Yen. Exaggrated but entertaining never the less. As for videos from teachers showing their fighting stuff? I personally don't see why they should bother. Even if a video was posted you'd just get a slagging match going on about either the lack of taiji principle, or that it's too compliant, etc. A total utter waste of their time. If you want to see what a teacher is really capable of then go see him or his senior/advanced students and see what they can actually do in the flesh. Or better yet, just claim that because you cannot see a video of them whooping someone's ass that they are therefore a charlatan and a fake. You are clearly right, because there is no internet proof to the contrary. The internet is of course the source of TRUTH, it says so in Wikipedia so it must be a fact!
In my post 98 is a link to a Youtube video about this "Wudang" Tai Chi (also known as Dan Docherty's Practical Tai Chi Chuan). It is a nice atempt to use Taijiquan for (sport) fighting. Too many Kickboxing and too little Taiji principles are used in my opinion.
However (almost) any Tai Chi style can be used for fighting, there must be only the right mindset and the correct use of Taiji principles. Many styles/teachers breaks the "Taiji principles" so their fighting is ineffective. In my opinion the most important and essential is the correct understanding and use of the Taiji principles.
What do you expect two bodies in the context of sparring to look like? Can you tell from the vid if they are issuing power using TC mechanics?Dealing with incoming power likewise? Explain how things would look different according to your idea of the actualization of TC principles. Naturally,such things are also dependent on the level of the practitioners involved, but barring someone at a much higher level relative to their opponent, I fail to see how peers, regardless of level,will look much different in their sparring practice, esp w/gloves on and attempting to make a decent amount of contact.
That is a sparring (sport fighting). It is not a "perfect" use of Taijiquan for real combat (self-defense). In my opinion the most evident fouls are: no enough adhering, no enough yielding, too much double-weightness, too much use of external force,.. However not bad, only too much "external".
Having been involved in many hours of videoing TaiJiQuan free training, both as participant and cameraperson, on thing is absolute. No-one can 'see' most of what happens....even the people who were involved when they watch it back. Because of the very nature of fa-jin, when applied correctly, it feels like nothing to the issuer, but is apparant to the recipient. Also, the same as it feels like nothing, it looks like nothing. Is this where the whole recent 'secrets' malarky started?? Carys.
And yet back up the thread you asked (in answer to the question of you learning tcc from books) for video of every one in a lineage fighting MMA as some sort of proof! All of your fouls are against logic and the English language.
liokault - "If you believe entirely in books, better not read books; if you rely entirely on teachers, better not have teachers." Master T.T. Liang I am learning about Taiji principles with practice not from "teachers". You and I look at Taijiquan with different eyes.
Is not my intention to criticize others (I have great respect for Taijiquan), I want only to provoke a constructive discussion (and take away BS from Taijiquan).
What doth I hear? Spruiking from yonder hairy arrse? A fool exposing himself! Assumeth I that in thine eagerness spurred on by youthful folly, thou hast dropped thine tracky-dacks to spread manure, sparingly disguised as wisdom. Aye, this is the only way a person can make a fair judgement. Any other way is total carumba baby ... lol.
Bailu Taijiquan - No, I don't "rely entirely on teachers". I learn from different teachers/instructors/masters, not only Taiji. I don't care about lineages, only that count are their fighting abilities. You don't have to agree with me. Walang Kadung - I agree that "the only way a person can make a fair judgement" is to "see what they can actually do in the flesh". But where are this Taiji people, why are not respected in martial arts community as fighters?
However there were few videos about Taiji and other IMA people performing sparrings from a (I think it was a Northern) Wu Style Tai ji Quan School from New York (from Wu Tang NYC - a branch of http://www.metal-tiger.com/Wu_Tang_PCA/ ) on Youtube, but they were removed (user wizcoolc) few weeks ago. That was in my opinion one of the best usage of the internal principles for fighting. The videos were: 1) Bagua vs Xing Yi Sparring - [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfxNgpuhecQ"]YouTube[/ame] 2) Bagua vs Xing Yi Sparring - [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gRGEipJvRzI"]YouTube[/ame] 3) Bagua vs Tai Chi Sparring - [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUHl-BQucHE"]YouTube[/ame] They did many errors, but also they were the better ones (in IMA field) that I (ever) found.
Who CARES Ethel! :bang: Who gives a tinkers saggy-daggy bottom if taiji is respected or not! Don't use books or video/DVD as your primary source ... and for goodness sakes Sikes, get your ass out of Slovenia and meet a few real people in the flesh. Get out of your cramped little cave ... then armed with your own direct experience you can come back to proselytise us all to death about the lack of "fighting practicality in taiji" :yeleyes:.
Walang Kadung - Don't get excited! Take it easy! And who are this "real people in the flesh", you? You don't have to agree with me. Don't take my (humble) opinions so personally. Who you defend? Please, make this discussion more constructive.
Do you want a list of names, or do you want videos of them fighting in UFC etc? Names are easy, but videos? Generally, the people I know of who are good don't put that many clips on youtube.... And generally, any clips they have are of drills/exercises - not trying to "show off" their skill, but to demonstrate how to achieve skill. But, if you want a couple of names, I'm more than happy to oblige.
