I practice an art that I can find no refrence to online, and can find no one that has heard of it other than the one who taught it to me. This person has been dead since 2003. I have been searching since to find another teacher, and slowly to find anything on the art itself. The name of the art is Kyu Kishu no Senpenbanka Or english 9 noble births of a thousand things that turn into ten thousand things With the alternate translation of 9 Secret strikes of a thousand things that turn into ten thousand things The art has similairities mostly to baguazahng, wing tsun, dim mak, drunken boxing, Shaolin snake with a hint of bujikan ninpo, and karate, but has from what I heard a japanese flavor. It is a very unflashy art with no kicks above the knee, and no spins or jumps. It has only 3 stances, 9 techniques, 9 belts and 9 degrees. Any thoughts on where to find a teacher or how to continue improving in an art no one seems to know about????
Lol I doubt I'm the last or I wouldnt be posting. I'm really hoping some people can point me in the right direction or tell me of a similar style so I can continue learning.
To be quite frank, if the style can't be found on Google, it's bogus. That of course doesn't mean any style found on Google is real. So count your losses and find a real art. Of course if you can post a video of Kyu Kishu no Senpenbanka techniques, drills, katas, or just kicking someone's ass with it, I might change my mind. Best of luck,
I was looking for any info online about Bagua zhang in Japan once, like who went there/when, what it may have turned into or if it was immersed into other arts or had influence etc that kind of thing. Anyway that was ages ago now and i couldnt retrace my steps now if i wanted to, but i can remember coming across something that refered to "nine changes". It stood out to me becouse Hakke Sho(u) (japanese for eight palms basicaly) always coincides with eight and this tangent i found myself on was basing itself around nine. No recolection of names for it but it looked as though it played out like you describe. From memory they had Gi/belts, only low kicks etc. I would look at Hakke sho or shou in japan and go from there. The "Kyo Kishu" part im guessing may mean "nine changes". You may have to concentrate your search in Japan and go from there.
Thank you Griffin that does help me pin down an area to start looking. This system is based on nine similar to baguas eight . Could you offer more detail? WarriotOfanart I am willing to post videos of what you need if you can give me an outline of what your looking for. I will not however Fight another person as it goes against my beliefs on self defense
lol... since when was Google the indicator? This reminds me of if it's not on YouTube it didn't happen. on a different note: Amusing and ridiculous at the same time. Sorry but that sound like something that is trying way too hard. You've trained this style before? Have you got Japanse or Chinese characters for this style? I'd love to see them.
I can't imagine what a style that combines all thatwould look like. I'd really like to see some ofit if you wouldn't mind, I'm not gonna make fun or anything (though I don't think it sounds legit, but that's not what you're asking for), I just can't wrap my head around something that's similar to all those things at the same time.
For the record Im not claiming legitamacy. Im am looking to learn more about this style. If it would help I will post video giving a rundown of the 9 belts which should cover enough to answer all questions and perhaps assist others in helping me track down some info.
I think the - 1000 things turn into 10 000 things Come from a translation of Senpenbanka which is "Innumerable changes, infinate variety"
Do you know where your sensei/sifu trained? China, Japan? Any idea where his instructor came from? Must be more to it than 3 stances and 9 techniques. That is extremely limited, especially if there are 9 belts. Does not sound real to me to be honest. Would take what you liked best and found most useful from your training and start focusing on that, be it wing chun, grappling, kicking, or whatever. Good luck!
oh dear, well perhaps not being able to find a new instructor in this particular art may not be such a bad thing (hint hint) have you considered perhaps just studying bagua or karate instead? It may well prove to be a more productive endeavor than continuing on with this... interesting... amalgamation
To the majority of posters: I am not here as a "troll" my question is sincere. This art has proven to be very effective for me more so than the others I have studied so I am not concerned about legitamacy. I do how ever wish to deepen my understanding of it. So any arts which you may think will help or any thing you may have come across that seems like what I am talking about will help. Anything else however is counter productive. To griffin: that seems a better rendering of the name. I only had a little help from an exchange student at my college and what I gave is the best rendering I could. Also Im looking iinto the hakke shou but only turning up naruto references and a man named tamura could you give me more info to help wed out the anime? To sensei matt klein I'm unsure of the origins, and there is more to it than just 9 techniques, however there are only 9 movements that change into parries, grapples, throws, etc. Here are the belt lessons as I learned them (I used terms that should be familiar to most not the, actual terms): White belt - Form first 3 sections - closed stance (intstinctive movement, explanation, structure) - closed stance application ( single arm defense, defense with both arms, natural reaction) - Form next 3 sections - Open stance (instinctive movement, explanation, structure) - changing from closed to open stance to use the elbow and throw contained in t change - Form last 3 Sections - change from open to closed to use the palm strike and chin na contained within - open stance (striking, throws, Natural reaction) Yellow belt - Punching Method, nerve networks, 12 major plexus, application - Elbow, arm meridians (heart, lung, pericardium) - palm, arm meridians ( large intestine, small intestine, triple warmer) - knee, upper leg meridians - kicks, lower leg meridians - Stepping (similiar to circle walking) - turning, meridians of the frontal torso - evasion, meridians of the head - falling, ground "stance", meridians of the back Orange Belt - single arm sensitivity, Min - dual arm sensitivity, Kou - reaction training, bao - leg sensitivity, ting - force removal practice , chui - force removal practice 2 , qu - force removal practice 3, ding - force removal practice 5, yuan - silk reeling, mind guided movements Red belt - principles of fighting, standing meditation 1, hand meditation 1 - principles of fighting, standing meditation 2, hand meditation 2 - principles of fighting, standing meditation 3, hand meditation 3 - Principles of energy, Walking (circular), hand meditation 4 - principles of energy, avoiding enemies, hand meditation 5 - principles of energy, foraging, hand meditation 6 - principles of power, standing meditation 4, hand meditation 7 - principles of power, healing basics, hand meditation 8 - principles of power, escape basics, hand meditation 9 Green belt - balance - timing - awareness - speed - strategy - agility - technique - deception - power Blue belt - Full form - Stationary dummy - Moving dummy - circling stationary dummy - Circling moving dummy - 9 stationary dummies - 9 moving dummies - 9 Mixed dummies - Sparring Last 3 belts cover weapons types in long medium and short range
Again I've got to ask... since it appears you have actually trained in this style before... Have you got Japanese or Chinese characters for this style? I'd love to see them. What part of China was your sifu from? Who was your sifu and what's his family name. Help us to help you. How so? Have you actually had to use it? Or by effective did you mean that you've trained it consistently and regularly?
I do not have any characters, everything I have was orally handed down. I have a last name I don't see how it can help though. I can give you a rough attempt as I'm unsure of spelling (should be obvious from my first post) Ishikiwa Im unsure where he trained to be completely honest. Sorry if this proves unhelpful. As for using it yes multiple times, in middle school I was sent to a school.for "trouble youth" to put it lightly and had to defend against my last sifus advanced student for leaving his system ( bet you can't guess why I left).
Your system may not be dead,but as one member joked you may be the current grandmaster.Perhaps lineage holder would be more accurate. Your system has a Japanese name,has a Japanese flavor, but uses Chinese terms.Did your ever teacher speak of the system's history? From what you've told us my guess is that your teacher or his if someone taught this system to him, was the creator.As you state it has a JMA flavor it sounds as if someone w/a background in JMAs learned Chinese boxing of some types to some unknown extent and developed his own system from whatever his combined knowledge was. Chinese systems have no tradition of belt levels or strict grading levels until the very recent era,so unless this was developed in Japan/by a Japanese some time ago the belt/grading was either a recent addition or was created along with the system very recently.Were you the only student of your teacher? Without seeing you all I can say is it sounds a bit Pa Kua-ish in the presentation.When you said "9 techniques" I gathered you meant nine major "things" which everything else developed out of.This also sounds much like PK.As does using multiple dummies-Yin Fu's PK uses multiple poles planted in the ground. What weapons are utilized in the system? If this was created recently,or even if it is a century or so old it may have been just something someone created for themselves and was not taught to very many at any time.And by that I mean maybe only 1 to 3 people in a generation.So you may never find any "relatives" because there may not be any.Nor any public history. You may wish to look into Pa Kua if you can find a teacher who's "got it" and is willing to teach it thoroughly.Not an easy find,but there are a few out there.Be aware that PK has differences among the various lines of transmission so a line w/a different flavor might not quite be a perfect fit with what you do-Cheng,T'ing-hua's line likes to throw a lot,Yin Fu's likes to strike more,etc.Griffin mentioned something he thought similar or the same as what you do,if descended in part from PK it would probably be post WII-I don't know of PK being taught in Japan before that period. Truth to tell,when you listed the similarities to other systems in your first post it sounded like "chop suey gung fu",but from the curriculum you gave us I don't think so now.Regardless when it was made it sounds cohesive and progressive rather than just a bunch of stuff tossed together .I'd still lean towards a very recent origin tho',but that's pure speculation/educated guess on my part. The only thing that really bothers me is the drunken boxing reference.This is a very,very, minor aspect of some Chinese systems which for some reason seems to hold a fascination for people in the last 20 or 30 years.It's not a system unto itself.This weighs heavily in my thinking your system was created during this period.Not that it matters how old it is. Edit-ok,so your teacher did have other students-I take your relations aren't good.
www.jisho.org gives 千変万化 - せんぺんばんか - innumerable changes; infinite variety for 'senpenbanka' kyu/ku = nine (九?) here are the results for 'kishu': http://jisho.org/words?jap=kishu&eng=&dict=edict
