Who studies Tai Chi, Baguazhang, Meihuazhang, or Xingyiquan with the intent of learning to fight? Have you ever used it? Were Dong Hai Chuan and Guo Yun Shen cool or what?
Hey there,I train BGZ for fighting and health,we often enter comps(all stlyes) we just wear singlets and kick boxing pants.Most of the time we get disqualified for illegal stomps and locks. But in general I don't find that many internal schools train for fighting. Yep it rules,I am a small guy so I think highly of evasion and our method of power generation.
Could you guys explain a little more about BGZ etc, so we all know what you are talking about please?
Hey there, Thats a big question,but I will give you a breif overveiw. BGZ stands for Ba Gua Zhang literally tranlated it means eight(ba) trigram(gua) zhang (palm) I first should say that there is many interpartations of the BGZ system and quite a few different styles.This is probally because the originator focused on priciples of application and taught each indivual differently,who in turn devloped differing system which they passed on.All of the students he taught were of a high stardard at other fighting practises.Some stlyes have one major form others have manyMost of the different stlyes do share the some principles of power generation,just expressed differently. The most obivious simularity would be the practise of circle walking,which all stlyles have in some fashion or another. Within the school I train with we use the circle walking as a body machanics training method performed fast and slow.There is one main form which is also performed around a circle focus on spiral power generation and twisting body movements. Everything else is partner work(lots of it) concentration on distance and timing,stimulas is presented(a attackes b this way)you perform a presented response and then finish(take them out) with fluid balance breaking soft tissue strikes lockes throws stomps etc.Focus is on flow,if it doesn't work you are encouraged to move on,strike and flow into somthing that will work in that situation.This training is preformed both slow and deliberate and fast and hard but always fluid and relaxed. OK thats the way we train,I talked mainly about the combat side,and there is a bit of spiritual stuff.I should add that some of our teachers phill emphasis is on survivial not win or lose. Hope this gives you an idea,but like I said there are a lot of different interpartations,I have come across a few just down here in OZ.
Baguazhang is Cantonese, Pa Kua Chang is Mandarin. Also, in the same vein, Xingyiquan=Hsing-I Ch'uan. Wish I could train at that kwoon. How many computer systems analyst type jobs are there in Sydney?
Hey There is a far bit involved with Circle walking,but no I never get dizzy. Khafra,finding a job wouldn't be a problem,but you may not like your dollar,it doesn't go far unless you travel to NZ Not trying to shoot you down but I have to correct your statment, Ba gua zhang is actually pinyin,used by PRC in order to romanize the characters,Pa Kau Chang is the Wade Gyles romanization most commonly used by Taiwan. These are the 2 main systems of romanisation for the Chinese character system,but there are many other variations.
That's right; I wanted to correct that right after I finished writing it, but the computer lab was closed. I know China wants us to use Pinyin now, but darn it, I still think Tao looks better than Dao. People regard it as a lot more mysterious when its pronunciation is almost entirely unrelated to its spelling...
well actually my friends ! in Taiwan they don't say pa kua either.They say Ba gua zhang too (and their pin yi or zhu yi sounds the same as the one in PRC) so I guess pa Kua has to be the name in Guang-dong hua (spoken in Hong-kong)
I think you missed the point there Benny,they are not different words just different romanizations of the same words.
I guess it doesn't really matter what you call it.They don't use that romanization it Taiwan cause they don't use any roman letters there (they have their own letter system in order to know how to pronounciate the words).Maybe it's a western invention.But than again it doesn't really matter ,does it ?
Yep no worries, whatever,use of " Letters "in general means its a romanization form. I can't help but think you have still missed the point.
I guess I don't Any use of Roman letters (abc...z) is romanization !Taiwanese don't use any Roman letters in their language.They have a different alphabet .The Romanization you are talking about was invented in the 19 century by two english man 'Wade-Giles'.According to the two -'Ba-gua'(chinese pinyin) is 'Pa kua'.I guess you don't speak Chinese nor have any Taiwanese friends to point out your mistake.If you still insist to be right ,There's nothing I can do to help you.
Ok,I think you refer to my statement "most commonly used by Taiwan".This does not say "it is the system that the Taiwanese goverment uses".You might also like to read the" there are many other variations"Example, a friend from Taiwan writes her name in romanized form as "chia",its character would be written in pinyin as "jia".The chia spelling is in the format of WG,I have meet many Taiwanese who use the WG format particularly for there names.You said "they don't say Pa Kua" this is where I beleive the confusion starts,as I am not refering to pronunciation,just the diferent romanizations of the words.And Yes I have had a Taiwanese person write Pakua in script. Mate in all truth I think you should just reread the whole thread. And thanks for assuming so much about me,but in fact I study Putonghua and have been to Taiwan and the PRC.In your last post you seem to say something that I have already said. Anyway It sounds like you have to prove something to someone and I hope you have all the luck in the world with that.
Benny and Kat. Benny, Chinese use characters, and yes, the characters for Ba Gwa Zhang (English us 8 trigram, Formation) is all the same. Whether you are in China, Maccao, Hong Kong, Malaysia, or any other Chinese country, they use the same characters. Pronunciations might differ between different people and different dialect. For eg. You say potato I say Potato. I say Tomato you say Tomato, but we both speak English. The term Chinese is actually very broad. Taiwan speaks Hokien, Hakka etc, China speaks, Mandarin etc, Hong Kong speaks Cantonese and the list goes on. These languages are all linked to each other in some way, but still they are different. What kat meant with the Romanisation is simply a more accepted manner of which to spell the words in order to get a more generally accepted way of pronouncing it. Just for the record, in Cantonese the pronunciation for Ba gua Zhang is actually still the same but I would probably say Bat (pronounced But, or Put) for 8. Now back to the original question. “Who studies Tai Chi, Baguazhang, Meihuazhang, or Xingyiquan with the intent of learning to fight? Have you ever used it? Were Dong Hai Chuan and Guo Yun Shen cool or what?” I only recently started learning Bagua, but I think I can get the feel for combat bagua very quickly. From what I have experienced, It seems pretty effective. The cool thing is, if your martial skills are up to s^&*, at least you would be able to confuse your opponent by walking around him (just kidding). I still want to see some real Hsing Yi. A good friend of mine (the same one who teaches me bagua) studies Yi Chuan, and his fighting abilities are pretty cool. Thats all from me. Off to the gym I go….
Thanks for the replys,I found the thread sort of going overboard in a big way,so thanks for draging it back on track.In future if people want to argue I think I will refer them to my PM,so as not to clutter the forum.
Internal Arts for fighting... I have studied hsingi and a little bagua ... As far as fighting goes its usually a case of keeping my mate out of trouble when he has an argument with the girlfriend ... goes out gets drunk and then wants to wack somebody... He has studied boxing and thai boxing before coming on over to hsingi... he says that he prefers to use technique that he is fimiliar with ... what he has done is incorparate some of the ideas of hsingi ... Instead of using a big right hand he is just as like to fold straight into and elbow then wrap around the guy's head for a pulldown into a knee or follow up technique from the left side... Scary thing about this is that it can happen really fast ... I would have to say its one of his favourite techniques for fighting when drunk... The fact that other kung fu ... wu shu ... um chinese styles will teach the hsingi five elements is I think a testimonial to the effectiveness of these seamingly simple techniques... oh yes and the chinese military also taught hsingi to there soliders during the second world war... Thats my plug have a good training session..._
at my club in the internal art program and we do spar in that class in the form of sticky/push hands.... you can go close fisted or open palm and there's no set rule on where you can or can't hit. I just finished learning the Yioung form and I'm still perfecting it... we do a lot of standing Yichuan and incorporate all the movement into our push hands or regular sparring for martial application...
I have... Studied Hsing-I, Tai Chi and a bit Bagua. We try to have the training with as mutch aplications as possible to not onley learn about our own body but allso be able to use it in real fighting. With the right instruktor these internal arts can be quiet effective and allso deadly. Mix these 3 internal arts and you have a fully functional self defence system with punches, kicks, locks, pressurepoints, throws and sweeps. (mind the spelling I am Swedish)
