Hi, I hope this is in the right section but if not i apologise. Id just like to hear everyones opinion on Contracts for Martial Arts tuition. Ive heard some people agree with them and many that dont. Im speaking now from the an instructors point of view. Is it so wrong for an instructor to be sure that he reaches his minimum amount of income in order to pay the rent of the dojang(s) that they teach from? Surely this is only attainable through students signing a contract and the money being paid automatically. It is hard as an instructor to have to teach through the summer months at a loss while students are in that summer lazy mood, or off at the beach having a relaxing BBQ. It does happen, and its unfortunate that the instructors should have to pay any loss, i know because it has happened to me many times in the past. In order to stop this happening i am moving over to contracted payments so that i know even if the students dont turn up i will still have enough money to pay for the rent of my halls. Id just like to hear everyones opinion on it. Im not ripping people off, in fact im still one of the cheapest clubs around in comparison ( not too cheap though, i do value what i teach ) and i dont make money out of my training, i do it because i love my Martial Arts and i enjoy teaching.
Where I live there are many martial arts schools. Almost all of them have contracts. Even the ones that charge less than the others usually require their students to sign a contract.
Try using the search option at the top of the page. There are at least a squillion threads on this you could join.
As a school owner, I will say this: My experience is far less of the greedy instructor trying to bleed the poor, unsuspecting students out of their hard earned money. It's more of having at least some legal leverage when some deadbeat has been coming to class w/o paying for months (and you let them come because they gave you some sob story/lie) and then they flip you off (sometimes litterally) and say "too bad, but there's nothing you can do about it". (BTW, I'm not just talking about my school, but I believe this includes the majority). Contracts also have all obligations for BOTH parties in writing. People often seem to remember things differently as time goes on or they don't always get their way. The contract also keeps the school owner honest to fulfilling his end of the obligation when it would be far easier to slip into a reactive mode. Finally, even though this may not be popular with some on the board, I really don't want students that aren't serious enough to make a commitment. For me to make a real difference in someone's life, it's going to take time. The quality of my product is the quality of my students and the lasting results they get. If someone comes to my school to get certain results and they drop out after two months of sporatic attendance, their response is not going to be when asked about us:"wow, what a great program. It's a shame I'm (or my child) is such a lazy flake that I didn't take advantage of it". It's going to be :"Oh, they never delivered what they promised (or worse)". With contracts, both sides make a mutual commitment to each other which is fully explained and agreed upon. This way, when Johhny whines "it's toooo hard". And the parents say : Well, I don't want to make him do anything he doesn't want to (or is too lazy to)". I have at least some leverage to keep them going past this hump. BTW, kids NEVER quit anything. Parents teach kids to give up when the going gets tough by letting them quit.
In TKD there was a system where you paid monthly, but you could attend every lesson by the instructor, as he taught every day of the week I got to train more so I liked it. Hopefully your students (and the parents of your students) will see it this way, the standard of your club can only get even better if everyone trains more often.Wouldn't sign a contract though. if you're a good instructor you won't be able to keep me away
IMHO, (written) contracts are BS. The instructor offers their services, states their credentials, and details their insurance. The student comes along and trains to their abilities, motivation levels on a given day, injuries/restrictions, and so-on. Any kind of contract provides no value. What's it going to say: "I the student will train to the utmost of my abilities every class"? Well you can't! My kids (education) schools have gone into this, and I just think "yeah-right" - it's another lefty liberal postgrad student's idea that has been adopted. Our club has moved to a termly subscription payment, by which I lose out if I'm injured, but I can live with that. But if there was a move to introduce a contract I would not be happy to sign it at all (and might start thinking McDojo). The only circumstance under which I would would be if it was a stipulation of the insurance, I suppose. In terms of kids commitment, sensei has seen it so many times over his many years teaching (and I have seen it several times too), where kids appear totally hopeless and just don't get into it and then suddenly it all clicks into place and you think "wow!". The idea of a contract stipulating that is daft. Furthermore, if two parties sign a contract that either wholly or in part does not reflect their intentions, then that is worthless.
Contracts are fine. As long as you know what you're doing. It's just a fact, Martial Arts is a business to some people and money is their motivation. That doesn't mean they are not excellent instructors. I knew my instructor had a lot to teach me and I signed a 3 year contract, of which one year is up and I have no intention of leaving anytime soon. There as someone on MAP who signed for a year and then found a better club after a month or so.
1. Enough with the "contracts are bs" stand. Most people don't have the common sense to read them, and then want to cry about them. If you don't have the intelligence to read something before you sign on the dotted line, you get what you deserve, to be quite frank. Especially if you sign without shopping around. And that, to be quite frank, is what usually happens. 2. Here in the states, contracts don't just provide payment requirements and whatnot. They also provide protection for the school in terms of waivers of liability. Don't know if you need them outside the US, but in the litigious United States, they're a must for any school owner with any functioning brain cells. 3. Half this argument comes from people who sign year + contracts and then get bored. There is a reason reputable instructors will offer 3 and 6 moths contracts as well. They know that some people will come in, be motivated, then lose their motivation and disappear. My only real beef with contracts would be these people. They don't ask for a shorter contract, and then disappear. Their problem, IMO.
Thanks for all that guys, i should have known that the subject of Contracts would raise a good argument. Id just like to let you know exactly why im switching to contracts - Our school decided that it would introduce the new XMA syllabus, im sure that most people would have heard about this program. I had a few students who were really keen and begged me to buy the program and teach it to them. So in the end after many, many promises of training every week and paying enough to cover the contract that i had to sign to become registered with XMA and receive the tuition material i agreed. I contacted XMA and immediately started to teach the program. Within 2 months, most of the students had left the program, deciding not to carry it on because they found it too hard. I had to close the XMA class but because i was signed to a 2 year contract and had to keep paying for something i couldnt really use. This along with the halls that i used to rent for the class means that im now around £3000 in debt, this could have been avoided with the use of contracts. I love to teach, i get a lot from it but i dont want debt - thats the only BS as far as im concerned. These are not contracts where the student signs to say they will attend class each week and try their best or anything silly like that. All it says is that they agree to pay a certain amount each month for a year, throughout that year it can be upgraded if they want to train more, down graded if circumstances change or even cancelled with 30 days notice. I never try to rip people off. I just need stability with the money side. Halls are expensive and im still in debt thanks to bad students who lacked commitment.
the problem with contracts is that you loose out when you are injured when you are busy at work when you have family commitments when you are on holiday you can end up paying for lots of training that you never recieve, which is rather like throwing money away. i have a particuly gripe against contracts after one of the local mcdojo's threatened to sue me after i cancelled my direct debit with them due to injury.
Our sensei asks us to pay him for the month on the first training session you go to that month - you only pay for what you attend but if you miss any of the classes that were prepaid for you don't get refunded. Needless to say it works and everyone finds it fair because it is a very low priced club - £15 per month for 1 lesson a week, £25 per month for 2 lessons a week, £25 annual licence fee/membership renewal
Those are examples of very one-sided contracts. My kwoon uses a contract, and those issues are hardly a problem.
The problem I have with contracts is that you can't really know what you're buying until you've been with a school for a month or so. I've seen far too many schools where the head instructor may be good and you're told that he/she teaches the majority of the classes but in reality is only there once a month. There are also a lot of just plain bad schools out there and I'm simply not interested in signing anything longer than a 3 month contract until I've had a chance to really try the place out. If I have even the slightest doubt at all about whether or not a school is good and they require a contract longer than 3 months to get started I'll go somewhere else. Anything more than a month up front is going to make me hesitant and I'll probably go somewhere else unless I REALLY want to study what they're teaching and there aren't any other options. On the other hand I agree with GangrelChilde, if you don't read the contract and are then unhappy about it later, well that's just tough luck. Read the thing next time. Also in the sort of case that 79samurai describes, in which the instructor is basically making an investment based upon what his students claim about what they're going to do I think a contract is reasonable to ensure that they follow through with their side of the bargain. --Michael
