Bag work progression.

Discussion in 'Training Logs' started by Matt F, Sep 27, 2017.

  1. neems

    neems Valued Member

    Maybe in that video,it's just the very basic technique,I think he didn't want to confuse people on what should be lesson number 1.

    He actually teaches his fighters that slipping to the left is effectively the same as throwing a right hand without letting the shot go,I think he made a video explaining that too.
     
    Hannibal likes this.
  2. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    Fair enough - I prefer to teach correct from ground up, but everyone has a different teaching method :)
     
  3. neems

    neems Valued Member

    His stance is not as central as yours,it's hard to see in the video I posted but his weight's more on the back foot than front.
    His feet are actually quite similar to how yours are as you throw the shot,only the left leg's further forward.
     
  4. Matt F

    Matt F Valued Member

    Yea would be good to see.
    Yea, and difficulty is disguising it. As in if you step with the left foot obviously or all the time, you get read.
    There's lots of right crosses...short ones...long ones. Sneak the foot in ones etc etc. There's no one perfect universal right cross.
    In fights, fighters never always get it perfect but it doesn't matter as long it's good for that moment.
    I'm not trying to be technically perfect , more Keeping the uncertainty of the fight.
    But that's not to say I'm neglecting trying to be technically something.....as in there's a difference between looking
    "Correct" and being effective in a random ever changing situation
     
  5. Matt F

    Matt F Valued Member

    Yea, that would be great.
     
  6. Matt F

    Matt F Valued Member

    I'm not neglecting all elements of what you say so hope it's not taken that way, though I have to go with who I have trained with and what I'm aiming for. As in with Thai boxing the lead leg should be strong and ready to take low kicks at any moment but could also be tapping, so to speak, ready to pick it up to attack or to defend kicks. For this There has to be some kind of tension in anticipation of taking shots at any moment. Also Bending the knees or softening too much breaks the tension and disconnects between the bals of the feet and glutes and rest of the body and use of the ground for rebound,power etc , more a feeling than something you see. Obviously not stiff like a robot. Also being too straight up makes its harder to defend takedown attempts.

    Not saying I'm perfect or anything or ignoring any critics and I can't say that I'll ever be perfect to look at and "correct"
    but have put down and people have not liked some of those shot when they have hit them and iv managed to get in and do it.Within the context of an ever changing fight perfect technique is one amongst many factors that determine an outcome.

    Would be good to see some bagwork
    I like the "hunting with the eyes" phrase
     
    Simon likes this.
  7. Simon

    Simon Moved on Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    I use the term along with "car bumper eyebrows", for those guys who look like they've taken loads of hits over the years.

    My personal view is that hitting someone hard isn't that hard if you have some basic fundamentals down, but I want my guys and girls tucked in tight and on balance to avoid getting hit themselves.

    I do disagree with your point regarding what I call soft knees.

    I think someone like Mike Tyson proves that point. hard hitting, but with incredible balance and switching of angles, best demonstrated with the D'Amato shift.
     
  8. Simon

    Simon Moved on Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    I don't see that the two are connected.

    Good technique stops you getting sparked.

    The "ever changing situation" is dealt with by way of better timing, balance, perception, time, counter time, cadence, tempo, and a multitude of other attributes.
     
  9. Matt F

    Matt F Valued Member

    That's cool. It's fine to disagree.

    In the ever changing situation of a fight the perfect thing is the thing that's effective at that moment. It's not saying that it's not worth having or trying to have good technique or anything , more that you try your best to be effective in terms of delivery and do your best to get it right rather than look correct to an observer. Having good technique will be continuously worked on...for ever. Definitely .No one would do anything though if they had to be perfect to some pre concieved idea or look , all the time, eveytime.its not possible .

    Watch knockouts and it can be seen that an observer could say this guy didn't do this or do that perfect to some written rule but he knocked the guy out. The effectiveness is there for that moment whether is was perfect, a bit perfect, nearly perfect or a bit unorthodox.

    Yea,definitely a lot of attributes involved.

    Sorry, it's going off thread.
     
  10. Simon

    Simon Moved on Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    I think you are misreading my posts.

    It's not about looking good, it's about recognising the mistakes we have pointed out to you.
     
  11. Matt F

    Matt F Valued Member

    Possibly misreading from both sides.

    It's not a routine critique or in that section or done with the impression that's it's going to be perfect and with no mistakes.
    Thanks for anyones feedback. Anything I feel valuable and reminds me of things will be taken on board.
    Just would prefer it if it's going to be done from others who post their bagwork too over a few minute rounds or who iv seen fight.
    Im my worst critique haha so don't worry.
    It's for my motivation after getting back from ACL reconstruction.
    I do my session, then film a couple of rounds at the end trying to be better than the last, knowing it's going to go here.
    I was apprehensive but it's motivating.
     
  12. neems

    neems Valued Member

    Your roundhouses are looking nice and sharp considering your injury and lay off,are they improving quickly as you go?

    I done my ACL too,and it took a good while to get the snap back in my left leg,even when I was back squatting what I could beforehand it still wasn't the same.
     
  13. Matt F

    Matt F Valued Member

    Thanks.
    Not sure if it's been quick or not.
    I just put a lot of effort into kicking again. Almost treating it like starting over. Especially as there were moments where it felt I'd be limping forever.
    Doing physio 5 times a day also made me realise that my body can take it if done often and not too over the top. Iv kept some exercises going and do them on my other leg too every day, and I now do more leg weight work. Also I stretch almost every day.
    I presume all this has helped plus shadow kicking often.
     
    neems likes this.
  14. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    This is nothing to do with your videos, but just the point... If you can't maximise your attributes with technique from a comfortable stance, how do you hope to maximise them from an unorthodox one you find yourself in when the poop hits the fan?
     
    Simon likes this.
  15. Matt F

    Matt F Valued Member

    By already accepting the uncomfortableness and random ever changing situation and chaos of fights and attempting to be comfortable in the uncomfortable moments that will happen. You could be be taken out of position, could miss, could have no effect, could get hit, stunned...all sorts might or will or could go wrong. Fights are not comfortable and whole point is for each fighter to make the other uncomfortable.
    If you think or want to try to insinuate that I'm saying that trying to be in a good stance is bad or wrong or not worth it, then your off the mark and I'm not sure where your going.
     
  16. Simon

    Simon Moved on Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    If you are training for a fight then technique and skill shine through.

    If it's self defence I don't even use the term fight, as I certainly don't want to be finding out if the aggressor is better than me and it's not a fight I want to be in.
     
  17. Matt F

    Matt F Valued Member

    Cool.

    I'll have some more clips soon.
    Aprehensive , but motivating.
     
  18. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    No, I'm just saying it carries through. Chaining muscles to generate power, minimising telegraphs, accuracy et al...
     
  19. Matt F

    Matt F Valued Member

    It carries through great if everything goes right.
    Fights don't go fully right though.
    All those things and more have to also carry through when your not in the comfortable stance that's been trained in a nice calm environment and engage in an ever changing, constantly moving environment as someone tries to knock you out. Training has to factor all that in. That's why there is no perfect, comfortable stance, strike, kick..whatever. There's variable ways depending on how your set at any given moment. You do your best to be effective from whatever position you find yourself in or are put in or have managed to get into.
     
  20. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    Sure, but that is still improved through good technique, which is improved through practice.
     
    Simon likes this.

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