Quote "I can say hooks will get you hurt in the street because it's easier to parry a hook then any other punch." I dont know about this one in my experience I have found that parrying a hook is pretty much a waste of time. To avoid a hook I have had much more success by ducking under the hook (Could be a shoot) or leaning back out of range. Jams can work but you have to be quick as the opposite hand will come at you the instant you jam the hook. As for people saying hooks are to slow??? I would say they never fought someone with good hands. Hooks are perfect in the range between straight punching and elbows. Its also good to hook coming out of the clinch and if you only use straight punches a good hooker has a distinct advantage to strike before a straight puncher gets into range. IMO If you dont know how to hook get on the heavy bag coz you ARE missing out on one of the best striking techniques out there.
Change it to 'I'm a ****-talkin' kind of guy' and you're right on the money! Oh, Ok... Despite you contradicting yourself , you're a tough guy!
Ha ha ha Sc0tsg1t... Neil throws pretty mean everything!! I'm pretty bruised from being his demo dummy last night. So do you train at the BB Academy then? If so we'll have to see about these 45 degree hands... interesting. _____________ Question for the street geezer here... if you're in close whilst "banging on the streets" do you not find that you don't have the correct range for a perfect cross? Also have you considered that on occasion you may wish to telegraph a punch (ABD anyone?). Sometimes you throw grabage to set up better techniques (ABC). Also you don't necessarily have to telegraph a hook. It does happen but not always and as the guys have pointed out its been proved in and out of the ring time and time again as a valid technique - just becasue you haven't mastered it doesn't mean you shouldn't train it. But then perhaps that would interfere with you bangin' time? And one final question while we're on it how do you target areas not accessible to a jab or cross i.e. passing around someone's guard for instance or their kidneys (are you purely a head hunter)? To say that hooks are a pointless technique shows that it is you missing the point mate.
By the way Bninski welcome to the forum. All discussion and advice of boxing is definitely welcome and as you have surmissed this forum generally only suffers from the occassion berk rather than complete idiots. Looking forward to hearing more from you - do you have some stuff from the other board that you posted before? By the way which forum have you jumped ship from? Dred
Mr Dredleviathan yes I do I do. I also ache from Neils class last night. I did try the 45 degree angle but my superior inability caused much consternation and I kept on forgetting to do it. Same old story, practice practice practice You will know me as the little bald Scots chap who knows how to throw someone but give me a set of gloves and I hit myself more than the opponent
dredleviathan When I'm not in range for a cross or jab I elbow and knee. I don't use circular attacks, that's just me. You do what you do. Yeah I do telegraph punches on purpose to see how my attacker will react, but usually I will feint instead so I can recover quickier. No I'm not a head hunter. I'm an "opening creator". I use Kali footwork to evade attacks. If you use a parry while using the Kali footwork it produces a world of opportunity. Honestly I go for the neck 1st, no breath no fight and I run a good risk of collaping their throat (oh well). My 2nd main target is the armpit/the ribs protecting the upper lungs. I try to break ribs alot. I don't try for them I strike what is given. And yes I do talk ****, but I CAN BACK IT ALL UP! I DON'T START **** , BUT I'M QUICK TO FINISH IT!
Calm down everyone!!! Goatnips, why do you only use linear attacks? Circular movement can generate great power. Also it opens up the striking possibilities. They can be quicker. Why? Hit with one hand and immediately cicrle it back to strike again. Linear strikes make each INDIVIDUAL strike fast but I find it easier, quicker to use circular motion. Multiple shots will rain down like hell! However linear motion takes less practice. Although do not underestimate it. Try to blend circular movement into your linear technique and you will find that you begin to flow.
I don't use circular attacks, but I do chain punch. I don't have the problem you were talkin bout I chain punch and power comes from hips. Why would you want 5% power increase with a 30-40% chance of missing. I'll explain later if you don't understand.
By the way I am keeping this calm but I have legitimate questions on this: How do you manage to elbow and knee without using circular attacks? The only straight elbow I can think of is when you drive the point of the elbow forward by shifting your whole body. All other elbows that I can think of follow a circular pathway as the elbow has to move around the shoulder i.e. if the shoulder is the central point, the movement of the elbow will relate to a point on the circumference of a circle which corresponds in radius to the length of your arm between shoulder and elbow. Personally I would prefer to elbow someone than punch them anyway as there's less chance of breaking your elbow than any of the bones in your hand when punching. But you still have to wait for the correct opening of course (like you said Goatee). Elbows are awesome tools. And from this I would therefore say that hooks and uppercuts are pretty much the same movement but with different relative hand placement and impact point. If you miss with the hook then you might get the elbow (who's seen a boxing match where a boxer elbows his opponent hidden in a hook?). I applaud the "opening creator" remark! I think its a shame that you have rejected the other priniciples from Kali which added to the footwork make an awesome arsenel of weapons/principles. One of the great things about the FMAs and in particular about the empty-hands side of things (which my instructors call Panantukan due to their lineage) is the practicality of it and therefore its relevance to street confrontation. Concepts I have had drilled into me are (and these come from Rick Faye's book on the subject as my own notes are nowhere near as readable): 1. Manipulate before you hit: Move the body into a position that is easy to hit – pulling, pushing & levering. Usually arms and head but can be done on any body part. 2. Use all your tools: Hands, elbows, forearms, head, knees, shins, feet. Use in creative ways – straights, backhands, backfists, hammer fists, knuckle punches, rakes, thumb/finger jab, slaps, ridge hands etc etc 3. Limb destruction: “Defanging the snake”. Limb destructions are economical entries in terms of motion used and opponent is less threat without his set of tools. 4. Angling & lead switching: Angle away from incoming attacks as with weapons training to put opponent in a better position for counter attacks. 5. Sectoring: Position yourself to account for the opponent's next attack & to allow easy counter attack. Its true that you can't always get the more 'artisitic' techniques to work in a live environment all the time but I think you lose some of the depth available in these wonderful arts by rejecting them out of hand. We've had similar discussions on MAP before. If someone takes a bit from Muay Thai, a bit from FMA, a bit from boxing, a bit from BJJ do they really understand any of these arts or are they just emulating the 'surface' detail? For instance we covered the MT long-guard at a seminar I attended this weekend as my MT experience is still low) . Now I've been known to do this in sparring before but it was only after the seminar that I began to really realize the depth of this technique. It's not just about sticking your arms out, its not just a distancing thing etc... I wouldn't have know some of the finer details unless I chose to investigate it further. Now I have to practice it and put it into my sparring. I'm all for taking the bits that work from an art (concepts man) but only once you've really looked in to them.
joe frazier knocked muhammad ali down with a left hook in their first fight.floyd patterson annhialated ingemar johanson with a leaping style left hook in their second bout.also i noticed that in enter the dragon,towards the end with bruce lee in the mirror room,he lashed out with a left hook as his opening punch after hahn scraped his back with the sword hands.his left hook looked lightening fast to me.as fast as any straight punch that tommy hearns or sugar ray leonard ever threw,and those guys were the fastest punchers i ever seen in boxing. i agree though that you can counter a left hook by ducking,bobbing and weaving and manuevering sideways.personally i've had to become more reliant on the hook punches rather than straight punches because of my recurrent elbow problems in my right arm.i can throw uppercuts and block with my right.but that's it.i cant throw a straight right cross anymore.way too painfull for my elbow.i used to have a decent straight right.not great but pretty darn good.my jab is good, especially with my 75"reach on a 5'9 frame.my left hook is somewhat powerfull and quite fast.i like getting in and throwing quick uppercuts as well. my style is to stand sideways,slightly leaning back and keeping my right hand up by my face while i shoot out the jab repeatadly,while measuring up my opponent for an opening.i like the counterpunch style.i'm more of the slow starter type.i dont go right in for the knockout.that would be plain foolish for me because it would resemble tommy morrison when he tried to knockout ray mercer with those bomber hook punches.thus tiring himself out prematurely and promptly getting ko'd in the 6th round. i look to duck under the straight punch coming at me before i setup for a left hook.it's simultaneous.like when you brace yourself to clock a baseball.duck down and come up with the hook while simultaneously bringing your right hand back up to your face to block the opponents counterpunches. it's all up to the individual.
Good to see some life in here. Tough to find a boxing forum that isn't a ghost town. I wanted to raise a question here for discussion. Actually a few. Any southpaws here? Any natural right handers who have switched to the left stance? I know Bruce Lee fought this way, wanted to have the strongest weapon at the shortest distance. Any thoughts on this strategy?
I'm right handed south paw. But not really a straight boxer. It has always felt more natural to me. I also like having a more solid jab and lead hook. Plus me Shooting off the left side is umm... "less then gracefull". But that doesn't have anything to do with boxing
me three... I've always felt more 'natural' fighting southpaw style. I agree that 'shooting' is much more graceful for me and weapons require less adjustment as well. Is this a common phenomenon?
BWAHAAHAHA I'm a southpaw that fights in the right stance! I suppose that years of wanting my fastest/most powerful leg in front. Although I concur about preferring having the stronger jab/lead hook for boxing (we do some "hands only sparring" sometimes) Although I have to say I feel quite comfortable in both stances. This is probably due to competition TKD requiring the ability to switch in order to get an opening. I have a questions for boxers, "How often do boxers switch stance, if at all?"
"How often do boxers switch stance, if at all?" LOL usually when they're in trouble or have been trained by Brendan Ingle ie Johnny Nelson/Naseem Hamed
Boxers will rarely ever switch, although it does happen. A guy will do it if his plan isn't working out, he's getting frustrated. Or I have also seen it if he injures his lead hand. And there are the rare fighters who train both effectively, but you rarely see it at the professional level.
I have to agree that hooks or Thai knees are for finishing in a streetfight.In the ring with gloves on you may be able to make a couple mistakes and take a few shots.In a bareknuckle brawl a good boxer will kill a slugger who throws wild haymakers or lead hooks.If you hit hard with fast straight shots a streetfight is over in 2 or 3 punches so wild mistakes aren't an option.As a southpaw I prefer to use jabs and straight lefts while circling a right handed fighter to the right.After landing a jab/left combo or a solid jab then you can bust a overhand left or straight left/right hook combo. From what I know of Bruce he preffered south paw.He had more power in his right hand and foot and this put them closer to the target.His side kick,right jab,right hook,and roundhouse kick were all increadibly fast and had brutal power from the southpaw stance
