you've got question, we've got answers.

Stick as for your question I can tell you from experience ninjutsu is in fact an all around style,You are obviously under that same impression alot of people are.Ninja were not asassins but more than likley farmers or perhaps lower middle class people.As for stabbing in the back Im sure it happened but that is not what ninjutsu is all about.It is more a life style perhaps a religion but I assure you being a ninja was an honorable way of life.

 

One thing I think is weird is why does it seem everyone needs proof. I mean, you can forge proof, so what's so great about proof if it could be fake. I mean, it should all be about the style, the instructor, and if it is done properly (like, are they really teaching how to kick, etc). I know people look for proof so they don't lose money but isn't educating yourself on the art better and watching the class preform more helpful than a lisence? That's just my opinion because I've seen some lisenced people who can't teach a lick.

As for the Koga thing. I think they still probably exist in Japan and other parts of the world. I mean, ninja's are a secretive bunch. Still, I think the Koga clan is smaller than the Iga because I think the Koga stuck with the family bloodline, father to son/daughter. While the Iga taught to the one's most deserivng of the family, like father teaches son, daughter, cousion. I think Iga was more open in their ninjutsu than Koga was. Plus, Koga was more into following the rules brought forth by the ruler than the Iga. I say this because when the Tokugawa regien started samurai and ninja were told to disband and the samurai and the majority of Koga did, only teaching it to family members. But the Iga did not disband and still teach their art freely. I think that is how it goes, or at least that's how I remember it.
So, Sato Ryu could be authentic even if it has gaps in the timeline.

 

Kalifallen,its nice to hear from someone who has a more opened mind,as you stated ninjas were very secretive and its not so far fetched that the koga still exsist.My sensei was from the koga region and I believe what he taught me is genuine,I realize there will always be doubters but kurohana did make a good point and so do you,some people have to have documentation in order to believe.So I will continue to train and enjoy my art as it was taught to me. I will also continue to teach this style to others so the line will continue. As of right now I have four students who have been training with me for six years now. I have had to slow my training because of health problems but I will continue as much as I can.Nice to hear from you. Have a good one Im sure there will be more posts to come.

 

Stick,

I came out of my first ninjutsu class feeling that i did'nt know as much about martial arts as i thought. I am starting right from the bottom rung again and u wouldnt believe how much i am enjoying it, I am so looking forward to what lies ahead for myself and my two young children, man i wish i was their age again.........DOH!

 

He's definitely is dead, and unless he came back from the dead, then whomever threatened you must have a split personality.

 

It irritates me to see pretenders of ninjitsu claim supremacy over one another like a political table of power being fought using grades and lineage of their styles. A student should be recognised not by his grade or stye but his/her achievements gained in life. When will you realise grades and certificates will not shield you from harm. You are each who you are with unique instincts. I have had many teachers and friends and been expelled and banned from many classes, but I learned what I know through patience, practice, and perseverance. Ninja have a saying, "train yourself, and be your own master."

Whatever it takes my friend, whatever it takes.

Yours in martial arts,

Kid.

 

Taken from the web site,

There is a member of MAP who used to live in Japan named Steve Delany. His screen name is Gunyo Kogusoku. When he was in Japan he trained in an art that is a member of the Nihon Kobudo Shinkokai. According to him, the quoted section above is a complete lie.

Go ahead and contact him if you don't believe me. "Sato-sensei's" stories of training under Toshitoro Yamashiro, etc should just be treated as tall tales. I think this guy also has been caught making claims of military service as well.

 

Is your Koga instructer name Toshitora Yamashiro? Just curious.

My .02 on this matter. I think why most people get their panties in a bunch over these secretive claims is because someone is duping unsuspecting students. Here is an analogy.

I learn a bit of French from books, maybe I actually spend a month or two with a French teacher. I then learn a little German, Italian, maybe some Swahili. I mash this all together to come up with my own hybrid-******* "style". Suddenly French becomes REALLY popular. So I start teaching French. I tell everyone that I can't tell them who my instructor was, they're dead, blah blah blah.

Finally someone with more knowledge than myself, calls me on it. They say, "wait a minute"! How can you be teaching French when it doesn't even sound like French except for a few BADLY pronounced words? The grammar is all wrong, you have words and structure from another language that isn't even related!

I feel like my lie is being attacked and I need to defend the illusion that I have woven around myself and my life. Finally as a last resort I say, " I never said I'm teaching French". I'm teaching FrInch.

Riding on the coat tails.

 

I read a really really really good article on Fujita... My sensei showed it to me, i'm sure some of u old farts know what im talking about. Basically it when on saying that BASICALLY, fujita COULD have learned koga ryu from his grandfather, but his grandfather died after a few short years, so even if it was authentic, he didnt get nearly as much information to become a "soke". Also the scrolls died with his grandfather...

I wanna go find this article now...

 

AH HA! found it:

http://www.bujinkanwakodojo.com/bwd_kogaryu_history.html

Some quotes:

AKA: CIRCUS

ANYWAYS

Like I said already... This doesnt mean that Fujita sucked... all it means is that he didnt learn Ninjutsu

 

No, it just means that we don't know for certain that he learned ninjutsu based on his own statements. There is a chance, a good one IMO, that he did. But the chance is there that he did not.

But on a realted note, there is this quote from the ask Soke page.

Real classy, huh? "Money Mill Pimps" and other insults at the Bujinkan.

But note that this guy claiming to be taught in Fujita Seiko's art talks about how he was killed in a car accident. But he was not!!!!! He died of liver damage!!!! So how come the soke or koga ryu does not even know how the old head of the art died?

Anyone claiming to have been taught by Yamashiro Tamatora should be looked at with suspicion because of all the red flags that go up about the story.

 

The whole "Sato Ryu Ninjutsu" thing caught my attention.

You see, I recently moved into downtown San Diego, and I was looking for a dojo to supplement my Ninpo training. I came across a place called "The Temple of the Autumn Moon", which I thought sounded nice. So, I gave them a call, and was VERY pleased when they said "We teach Ninjutsu".

My heart raced, and my eyes lit up as I thought "Great! I'll be able to train daily after work, then train on the weekends with my personal instructor! I can't wait!", to which I thought, "Oh, wait...I hope they're Genbukan...since my main instructor is Genbukan, I don't want to get into politics...should I not tell them..."

I agonized for a few moments, then blurted out, "Oh great! Are you affiliated with Genbukan, Bujinkan, or Jinenkan?" I figured I'd get it out in the open, and state my case. That way, I could find out whether or not I'd get in trouble.

Considering that my only experience with Ninpo comes from Hatsumi-sensei, Tanemura-Sensei, and Ashida Kim -p), I assumed that any LEGITIMATE, well-known Ninjutsu school was affiliated with an X-Kan. You could understand my surprise when she said, quite abruptly,

"Oh, neither...we teach Sato-ryu Ninjutsu...", After my blubbering questions as to symantics and syllabi (do you use the standard Ichimonji No Kamae, etc...), she quite rudely cut me off and said, "Just visit our website. Good bye."

Well...the instructor uses a strange African sounding surname, is a reverand, and runs his school as a "Church-do".

In true Japanese fashion, I clutched my jaw and ran screaming from an imaginary Godzilla.

Still, I've wondered how authentic that school could have been. Thanks for the clarification, guys!

May you achieve
Satori

 

Sato, Soke Yo.- WA 11/2005: Claims to be former US Navy SEAL Team 6 member and "other Special Operations groups." Claims to have been captured and held POW in Kosovo where he claims to have been tortured by having been buried alive, shot twice, stabbed and finally electrocuted prior to be rescued by his fellow "Ninja Brother." He then claims that he died twice upon the operating table and had to have a steel plate put into his head as a result of his injuries sustained while in Kosovo. He also claims numerous Purple Heart and Silver Star Medals. There are more but witnesses could not keep track of all of his claims.


Mr. Sato had a legal change of name and is formerly known as Jason Dale Hamilton. You can obtain a copy of his name change case record by writing to the Thurston County Courthouse located in Olympia, Wa for a fee of $5.00 USD. Request case# 64076

Like Mr. D'Antonio his Martial Arts credentials are being questioned by former friends, students and other Martial Artist from around the globe. Most believe they too are as fraudulant as his claims about his military service.

It is alledged that Mr. Sato has frauded students out of money here in the US as well as in in Europe (specifically Sweden) where he alledgedly lied to them about being a former US Navy SEAL and more. Mr. Sato is also reported to become angry and hostile when questioned about his credentials.


This information was gatherd at http://www.specsec.org/CDWall.html.

I know Bujinkan freind of mine contacted his affiliate Bufukan Ninpo Bugei David D'antonio.

After several emails Mr. D'antonio admitted that he trained in the Bujinkan in which he received a 4th dan (if memory serves me correctly) These guys are obvious frauds and should be considered nothing less.