Cheng Man Ching, via Master Huang Shen Shyan (sp?), probably modified a little further by my teacher(s), according to their understanding. 37 step short and 108 long form, also with 'Fast Fist', derived from White Crane; fast and springy, real fun, and reputedly devised by a woman!
Never heard of weight not forward in end position of say,Brush Knee in CMC's TC.This is standard.Did Huang initiate this?Never heard he made such a radical change.Not saying you can't use it,but TC operates more often from the front leg platform utilizing the hip kua after/in conjunction with shifting forward.No disrespect meant,but did your teachers study something else?How long did they study Cheng's Yang?Or am I misunderstanding,and you mean you wouldn't stay in forward position,which is understandable?BTW,Tan Pien is the posture Single Whip,which wasn't a regular forward stance,tho' some of the seniors of CMC have changed it to one.Huang was a very high level Fukien type White Crane boxer before challanging Cheng,so it's cool you're getting some of that.
Operating from the front leg sounds to me more like Wu style (we had a student 'convert' from Wu, she was always solid in her front leg). Of course we use the front leg, it would take a long time to explain - perhaps I'll pm you some time. My teacher trained with Master Huang for a long time, I don't want to get into a long discussion, but his practice is phenomenal, very soft but very effective issuing. Hard to learn, mostly because it takes time to train the muscles to develop - we don't use contractive force, but try to use stretching muscle - I'm not sure I can explain it adaquately, suffice to say I have seen it and occasionally can produce it myself. The biggest problem is that it takes a lot of cooperation from your training partner whilst you are developing the technique ('invest in loss!').
OK Sparrow.I thought you were speaking of weight distribution in CMC's form.I think I get what you're saying re elongating soft tissue.Of course you can issue out of the rear w/out going forward,I just said TC (practitioners) operate more often from the front platform after or with shift forward.You can see Cheng do it in his films,and Wm. Chen makes it obvious.Natch,it depends on what your executing at the moment.Thanks.
Refering to Yang style. The easiest way to get correct knee position is to make sure it hides your toe when you look down (both legs). This ensures you open the kua and create the leg circle (sphere). If you do this with back foot straight ahead the kua does not open. Forward and side stance should be approx equal using this formula. Your root should be structural before you make it function energetically and should be all round. If you only have forward stance and no side stance then your root is vulnerable and easily broken in the cross and diagonal plane. This is bow stance as in "brush knee". In riding horse stance the feet are angled out slightly from the parallel or to the front or if the energy is directed to the side then the foot on that side rotates to the angle of delivery as in "single whip". Proviso is that up to 2nd generation Yang forms use riding horse for single whip, where as 3rd onwards use bow stance. This creates some confusion as in riding horse stance the feet are practically in line, where as Bow stance is standing on opposite corners of a square. Many modern variations have simplified the development work of these stances to simplify the form and lose structural basics in the process. This is development form (Large Frame) and is very grounded / rooted in nature, it helps develop peng energy (floating spring). Early Yang forms also have what is known as follow step moves, which you also see in Chen and Wu/Sun styles (almost every move in Sun style). This helps develop Qing or lightness or quick skills. Basically a step forward is followed by a step up with the back foot at the hand / arm application. A good form should have both IMO
I would just like to take this opportunity to point out that I'm an idiot. I was walking yesterday morning, and remembered this post. I have no idea why I say Xubu (empty stance) and translated it as 4-6 stance. I'll be back on the forum once I'm done punching myself in the groin.
In order to actually contribute something, I'll mention that at the stage I"m at anway, my teacher has me shifting virtually all of my weight onto the lead leg in a bow stance. The back leg is empty for all intents and purposes. Of course, I'm pretty new to the game (Maybe 50-75 taiji training hours) so who knows where we'll go. I was honestly skeptical about commiting that much weight to my lead leg at first, but as I became more comfortable generating movement fromt the kua and waist it started to feel pretty good.
I'm puzzled as to having such a lot of weight in the front leg in Yang style - if you issue from the front leg, where does the weight 'go' after? Richard - very refreshing to hear reference to 'opening the kua' and the stability of the stance, though our horse stance is always parallel.
Front or rear leg,weight doesn't have to go anywhere afterwards.Front or rear platform(weighted leg) you can issue from that side or the opposite. And Mr. Dunn,I feel the removal of follow steps in certain main forms was an unfortunate decision indeed.
Interestingly enough, on the few occasions where I've seen my teacher an seniors practicing the Long Boxing or two-person drills, I seem to remember seeing the follow-up steps Mr. Dunn described. I'll have to watch that closely.
Follow steps still exist in apps and partner training,in the post 1920ish Yang/new Wu branches.If you're doing Yang/ new Wu style and the 1st form has follow steps you must be doing an older version,pre Yang,C-f and Wu,C-c c changing their forms.Enjoy!
