whats with all the ageisum here, how old do you think is to old? what reserch/ experiance has prompted you to say that you body will fall apart/ache if you do a certain type of , but not if you do another. i started with no experiance, training in gymnastics/acrobatics when i was in my mid twentys, now that i'm 34 i can do more and harder stuff than i could when i was 20. i train hard but sensible, and have no problems from my body. i know of quite a few people older than me, who either started late or still train hard in acrobatics with no ill effects. i fully intend to be doing this stuff well in to my 50's and beyond. its all just a case of proper training and looking after your self. also martial arts are no less of a challenge on the body when performed properly than acrobatics.
Tying in with what was dicussed about pink fluffy fans, how dangerous they were, and how some of us have all different types hanging above our beds, I thought I'd share a little something I found: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fan_death
If you think about this part of your statement mate, it kinda answers your own question. When was the last time you saw kuk sa nim do a form in a demo. You don't see it cos he can't do it low and dynamically as someone else because of his age. Now when he was 20 i'm sure his forms rocked. So age is a factor in any training. Sure you can do the exercises but you will be more prone to injury, and the injurys will take longer to heal. Thats a medical fact, because of the genetic changes in your body and the way it realligns its hormones and things as you grow older. Ages is a factor definately. However, I do understand what you are saying there is no reason you can't carry on with that type of training its just a case of being more careful. XMA and gymnastics tho will be constantly dominated in comps by younger people very few go on into their mid 30's.
i agree monk, and i fully realise that age eventually gets everyone, but to start saying people are past it just because their not in there teens or early twentys is wrong and very annoying. carefull practice and a good understanding of what your body is capable of at that moment in time will prolong any sort of activity. i have a 45 year old brown belt, who is just now learing to handspring and backflip, can do all the breakfalls and is just as fit as the twenty somethings she trains with, all of this achieved without any prior experiance in either martial arts or gymnastics. try telling her she's to old. most pro comps are dominated by the young, but recently that has started to change, it is not unusual to see 30+year old people competing at olympic level. also a great example of the older generation still doing impossible things is a 52 year old Jackie Chan.
Yeah i fully understand what you are saying i truly do my dad got his blackbelt at 54, But, if you ask him, he'll tell you how much easier it woulda been at 20. And agreed that an older person can be as fit as a younger one, but i can tell you one thing they will have to work a hell of a lot harder at it to even get to the same level, so their dedication will have to be more to acheiving that fitness goal. I would never ever tell anyone they are too old ( apart from Big D who i gain great pleasure in telling him he is getting old ). Bet Jackie Chan wakes up with more aches now than before tho and everyone of his breaks takes longer to fix.
KSN is forty-something, been doing KSW for 10 years. I've heard him talk about how his cartwheels when he started were very low, "hand, hand, foot, foot" and nowhere near straight. At the promotion demo Friday he was doing hand springs and front flips. And then I think about the fact that I started TKD only a year after he'd started KSW. If only I had been able to stay in training...
That is simply not true. from "Peak Performing for the Older Athlete" "1. Acute injuries come on suddenly and are usually associated with some kind of trauma. Common examples include: Ligaments torn or damaged by unusual or excessive movement of the joint; Impact injuries, where one or more of the joint structures is damaged by an external blow; Protruding/prolapsed intervertebral disc, where unusual intervertebral Forces lead to the deformation of the disc, allowing it to come into close proximity with nerves 2. Chronic injuries tend to come on quite gradually, thus making them trickier to diagnose. Common examples include: Overuse injuries, where the long-term training volume exceeds the capacity of the joints involved to undergo adequate repair and recovery Muscle imbalance injuries, where the joint fails to operate through its correct range of movement because of unequal or unbalanced muscular forces acting on the joint, or (particularly in the case of the spine) inadequate stabilisation of the joint(s) by the deep postural muscles 3. Degenerative conditions are associated with longer-term, less easily reversible functioning of the joints and are much more common in mature athletes. These conditions frequently include: Arthritic-type wear and tear, where the articular cartilage becomes worn, leading to narrowed joint spaces, sometimes referred to as osteoarthritis Rheumatoid arthritis, an inflammatory condition of the joints caused by an auto-immune reaction Low synovial fluid secretions, leading to reduced lubrication in the joint capsule. Common to all these causal factors is the process of inflammation. Although part of the normal healing process, it can actually impede this process when it becomes chronic. So those are the causes." To conclude a result of training for all through anecdotal evidence of a select few is not sound. First of all, proper hyung training is a lot better for the body than XMA type activities, of that there can be no doubt. Although I am sure there are a few exceptions. I am sorry if it is annoying, but it is true. For the most part, physical activity for people at or older than middle age is simply different and needs to be approached differently. What really annoying is when one assumes that if one person who is 42 can do something, that it is ok to ask thier peers to also attempt it. Something as seemingly simple as a cartwheel can be so simple for one and absolutely terrifying and innappropriate for another at that age. How many 35+ yo's are doing gymnastics/xma/type stuff? Virtually none. While this is true, at what price? To what extent will modern sports medicine be able to help them do these things, probably quite a bit. The real question is , is it worth it?
1) is a risk that can be minimized or accepted. If XMA is mostly forms rather than full-contact sparring, then it is a matter of the individual designing the form to suit their abilities. 2) sounds to me (complete NONexpert here, so feel free to correct me) like it is preventable with proper training to balance the muscles, and proper rest & recovery. 3) is the biggie. Not everyone has those conditions. My understanding of what I've read (not specialized literature) indicates that staying active can help with these things...
My understanding of this condition is that it is bought on by a decrease in the cartiledge at the joint. Cartiledge reproduction like bone, decreases as you get older so therefore anything that involves an impact and thus the closing of this joint and the rubbing of the 2 surfaces together will result in a higher chance of developing the condition as you grow older. NON IMPACT training is good for blood circulation and strength at these joints yes. But, even Sun Jin has advised my instructor that jumping should only really be specialised in when you are under 30. Obviously if you start after this age you need to learn the kicks etc, but it should be done with care.
Sounds reasonable. I think the condition is called early onset osteo arthritis, and it does not start to really hurt until long after the damage is done. check here for more http://www.arthritis.org/research/research_program/Osteoarthritis/genetics.asp check here to read about the onset of osteo arthritis in a 28 year old from simply jogging. http://experts.about.com/q/Rheumatology-including-Arthritis-986/osteoarthritis-28.htm or here http://www.sportsinjurybulletin.com/archive/exercise-induced-osteoarthrosis.htm Wow master of deep knee bends said that? I can't believe that came from the same guy who I heard tell a room of overweight, out of shape adults that they should grab their ankles a do 10 sets of 100 deep knee bends and "don't worry, really good for your knees" 10 years ago. whaddaya know he might be on to something!
Could it not be that back then KJN Sung Jin said that but has since studied health & fitness in more detail and educated himself and now no longer advocates such training for overweight people?
For his own sake, and the sake of the people he means to lead, I sure hope so. But I wouldn't hold my breath
I can only speak from my personal experience, but Master Suh has never made me do anything that hurts my joints. I say "I can't do that because my whatever is hurting" and he says "o.k. do this". The one constant is that at the end of a training session I am wiped out.
