xma kuk sool style

Discussion in 'Kuk Sool' started by kswflip, Jul 18, 2006.

  1. Choiyoungwoo

    Choiyoungwoo Guest

    Well I guess it could be characterized that way if you don't know what you are looking at. Some people say that the fans distract the opponent for counter attack. I think the fans are so distractive that they keep you from seeing what the techniques are actually for. Even most Kuk soolers don't get it, they just slap away and "play with frilling pink and green fans". And if you don't know, than you shouldn't be told. Ignorance is bliss. So, in a round about way the fans do thier job in that they keep you from seeing whats important. Please don't assume that there is nothing more to it than "playing with frilling pink and green fans". There is actually something to learn from the skills that has some function in training and application. If you are unable to see that, then that's ok. But don't assume that it's only what you see on the surface.

    On the other hand, Is there something deeper to XMA and tricking that is more than incredible youthful acrobatic ability that will fade with time, age and connective tissue? Please educate me, I am willing to admit that I don't see it?

    Ignorantly yours

    Choi
     
  2. MadMonk108

    MadMonk108 JKD/Kali Instructor

    You've missed the point, Choi (Do you pronounce that Choy or Chwae?)

    Attacking a practice for its substance is one thing.

    Attacking it for it's form is another.

    If I say XMA sucks because it lacks substantive martial applications, that is one critique.

    If I say XMA sucks because their uniforms are HUR-HUR T3H SUX0RS...that's like saying Kuk Sool sucks because the fans are really really dumb colors. It shows a lack of understanding on both counts.
     
  3. Wolf

    Wolf Totalitarian Dictator

    only two pages to for the point to be made clear :D good points though. Sorry if my comments didn't help matters. I was in a goofy mood today, and my attempts at humor may have just clouded things up. :bang:
     
  4. Choiyoungwoo

    Choiyoungwoo Guest

    Well I guess it could be characterized that way if you don't know what you are looking at. Some people say that the fans distract the opponent for counter attack. I think the fans are so distractive that they keep you from seeing what the techniques are actually for. Even most Kuk soolers don't get it, they just slap away and "play with frilling pink and green fans". And if you don't know, than you shouldn't be told. Ignorance is bliss. So, in a round about way the fans do thier job in that they keep you from seeing whats important. Please don't assume that there is nothing more to it than "playing with frilling pink and green fans". There is actually something to learn from the skills that has some function in training and application. If you are unable to see that, then that's ok. But don't assume that it's only what you see on the surface.

    On the other hand, Is there something deeper to XMA and tricking that is more than incredible youthful acrobatic ability that will fade with time, age and connective tissue? Please educate me, I am willing to admit that I don't see it?

    Ignorantly yours

    Choi
     
  5. ember

    ember Valued Member

    I'm not entirely sure myself, since I've never watched an XMA match. But some of what I have read in the Weapons forum suggests that it has entertainment value.

    Coyote can probably write an article on the importance of humor to long-term health, and of "questioning the system" to the health of an organization. Certainly he can point you to a number of books on the subject. If we can't laugh at ourselves, we're in sad shape.

    I don't know if you had the dubious pleasure of watching "Dae geup hyung, and we wanna go home..." but it sure made me laugh.

    Considering that the gymnastics sections were one of my favorite parts of P.E. class--and there was much of P.E. I didn't like--I would absolutely love to learn how to do some of the tricks and flashy gymnastics moves. Just for fun. That is one of the things that attracts me to KSW as a martial art.

    In my Cultures of Asia class, we watched a video on Kung Fu that showed the temple boys doing some interesting head-spinning moves, resembled breakdancing in a way. I'm not sure if it has any uses other than redirecting the energies of male youth... but I would suggest that keeping the young men excited and interested in something positive like KSW is a benefit.
     
  6. Choiyoungwoo

    Choiyoungwoo Guest

    I don't recall ever saying it "sucks" for any reason, I think it is formidable skill. Just not MA. Its form is as good as any gymnaist or performance artist. Maybe better. The training involved in acquiring these skills involved deserve respect as much as the aforementioned. It should be called Martial Gymnastics. But the xma label fits current meaningless pop culture, so it sticks. But is it any less "extreme" than MMA, or Iaido, or sumo? No. Take a look at Sumo training, thats extreme. (Extremely nuts. lol)

    And no ...it's not at all the same. There is a cultural, Martial Art, or military meaning to the colors, patterns, uniforms, and skills in KSW. ALL of them. I will be willing to cite any 3 of them for you, if you can cite 1 substantive aspect of XMA other than it's entertainment value.

    Now I am willing to stretch myself to concede that there is some potential application of xma......possibly, because I realize that is base in part comes from Martial Art (probably Wu Shu type stuff), so it must contain some, but I fail to see any deep seeded meaning to any aspect of the xma world. It's just a great show. If you like it ,,,go for it,,,,do it. But it's only parallel to MA training is the fact that hard work is involved to get the skill. But it is almost as distant from MA as ice skating, or lacrosse.
     
  7. AirNick

    AirNick Valued Member

    I do agree with you Choi, it's the McDonalds of Martial Arts.

    Don't get me wrong, I love tricking but I just consider it as something else that I do, it's not part of my Kuk Sool and doesn't have anything to do with it really. Agreed I put some of it in to the acrobatics demo's but that's just for showy demo stuff.
     
  8. kswflip

    kswflip Valued Member

    thanks air nick thats it your kuk sool is fantastic and your tricks give you some thing else would be great to shear with the rest of kuksool
     
  9. JSun

    JSun Valued Member

    Me too. Mine's just bolted up and connected to Romex with 110 volts running through it :D
     
  10. ember

    ember Valued Member

    ROFL! Okay, I have one plugged into the wall beside the bed, with a charcoal filter in it to help cut down on the cat smell...
     
  11. MadMonk108

    MadMonk108 JKD/Kali Instructor

    You're still missing the point in your overzealousness to defend KS.

    Dubu posted a very superficial criticism of XMA. I, as well as You Won Hwa, pointed out to him that KS practitioners also wear black and silver outfits...and play around with pink and green fans.

    It doesn't matter that there are reasons for cultural of military meanings of the colors in Kuksool. That's what's on the inside. From the outside, it's just as fruity as Dubu's critique of XMA.

    Your entire argument shows you missed my point.

    Dubu criticized XMA for it's form.

    I can just as easily criticize KSW for its form.

    Both of us would be mistaken.

    Criticize something for its substance or lack thereof.

    Think about that, then respond, because your previous response was a jumble of the two.
     
  12. Gi Ma Ja Se

    Gi Ma Ja Se 90 degrees is 4 real MA's

    Good thread guys

    just my 2p

    All the extreme stuff is great to watch especially when they do vertical kicks and hold that leg up there and just kick kick kick... shows to me alot of commitment and time has been spent training, but to be totally honest im more impressed when i see kjn sun jin does double sword or crane on a cloud form.

    I guess its because i can relate to a demo of KSW better than an XMA demo but isnt this what this whole thread is about??? Everyones particular tastes and enjoyment from MA...... and mine is clearly that i enjoy traditional values in KSW more so than that of an XMA style

    each to their own i guess :D
     
  13. Choiyoungwoo

    Choiyoungwoo Guest

    I think the ksw band uniforms are just as goofy, and I am rarely first in line to defend ks on the superficial stuff. So I'll just leave it there. I think the contrast between KS and XMA are clear for the most part.

    BTW...we probably have matching Glocks, i don't keep my fans out......way to dangerous. :D
     
  14. MadMonk108

    MadMonk108 JKD/Kali Instructor

    You got the 23 in 40 cal?

    I'm talking about the fan of course.
     
  15. kswflip

    kswflip Valued Member

    i didnt mean for ks to go xma just some tiscking thats all just wanted some views didnt want to diss the uniforms of other styles or there forms or anything like that , thats not what im am adout.
     
  16. PopeCoyote

    PopeCoyote The words of the fool

    Oh gee, thaaaaaaaanks. Seriously though, that's actually one of the reasons I chose "Coyote" as a on-line handle. According to some Native Americans, the totem of Coyote is a trickster, healer, and a teacher. You've all heard about the healing power of laugh, and one of Coyote's jobs is to use said humor not only to heal, but to teach. Let's be honest here, sometimes comedians can tell the truths that people won't accept coming out of other people's mouths because they disguise it as humor. As far as "questioning the system" goes, sometimes people make the STUPIDEST rules for people to follow, and only by poking fun at it can we bring it into the "light of day" and expose it for the farce it is. In short, there are several uses for humor, and as someone who greatly respects the totem of Coyote, I use it whenever its necessary to accomplish a variety of goals.
     
  17. KSWsam99

    KSWsam99 New Member

    Ouch
     
  18. Choiyoungwoo

    Choiyoungwoo Guest


    ksw flip....If I offended it was not intended. I know i can be a little blunt sometimes. I don't hate xma,mma kikcboxing, or any other aspect of MA, If you have the time and desire to do some of those things fine have fun and be safe. Just don't forget that when all that stuff is yesterdays news, and your body starts to charge you extra for your youthful endeavours :cry: and it will... you will need your body, so be careful, because KSW/TMA will still be there to challenge you for all stages of your life, and you will not want to sit on the sidelines.
     
  19. Wolf

    Wolf Totalitarian Dictator

    wow, very well put! I really like that perspective!
     
  20. kswflip

    kswflip Valued Member

    thanx choi and no offence taken as kuksoolwon go's we do acrobatics just wanted to get better and be able to teach it for all my students
     

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