why train in other arts when it seems like

Discussion in 'General Martial Arts Discussion' started by Rmjim, Aug 23, 2018.

  1. pgsmith

    pgsmith Valued dismemberer

    Seriously? How many people do you imagine are out there with "a good boxing or wrestling or bjj background" that are out accosting people? There are only a couple of actual instances where you would be accosted by anyone, trained or not. One is if you were in a high crime area and looked like someone that could be easily robbed. With your size, as long as you maintain a good awareness of your surroundings, the odds of you being accosted in this manner is probably infinitesimal, and you should worry more about being struck by lightning. The second instance where you might be accosted is by a belligerent drunk or drug user. First, drunk or high folks are pretty easy to avoid fighting with, and those potential fights can usually be de-escalated with a little logic and humility. Given that fact that they are either drunk or high, they should be impaired enough to so that if you are forced to engage, any training you might have would be more than enough to overwhelm them. if you're truly worried about your personal safety, you would do far better to train in something to improve your situational awareness and skills in avoiding confrontation rather than worrying about actual fighting skills.

    There is a lot of information to be found on the internet. The unfortunate fact is that 99.9% of it is biased toward whatever the person writing it is selling. Your best way forward is to decide what you're really looking for in your training, then go out and get that. Wanting to train in order to win some nebulous idea of a "street fight" that will most likely never happen in any way, shape, or form is a Quixotic endeavor at best, and could be a waste of your time and effort.
     
  2. pgsmith

    pgsmith Valued dismemberer

    Seriously? How many people do you imagine are out there with "a good boxing or wrestling or bjj background" that are out accosting people? There are only a couple of actual instances where you would be accosted by anyone, trained or not. One is if you were in a high crime area and looked like someone that could be easily robbed. With your size, as long as you maintain a good awareness of your surroundings, the odds of you being accosted in this manner is probably infinitesimal, and you should worry more about being struck by lightning. The second instance where you might be accosted is by a belligerent drunk or drug user. First, drunk or high folks are pretty easy to avoid fighting with, and those potential fights can usually be de-escalated with a little logic and humility. Given the fact that they are either drunk or high, they should be impaired enough to so that if you are forced to engage, any training you might have would be more than enough to overwhelm them. If you're truly worried about your personal safety, you would do far better to train in something to improve your situational awareness and skills in avoiding confrontation rather than worrying about actual fighting skills.

    There is a lot of information to be found on the internet. The unfortunate fact is that 99.9% of it is biased toward whatever the person writing it is selling. Your best way forward is to decide what you're really looking for in your training, then go out and get that. Wanting to train in order to win some nebulous idea of a "street fight" that will most likely never happen in any way, shape, or form is a Quixotic endeavor at best, and could be a waste of your time and effort.
     
  3. Monkey_Magic

    Monkey_Magic Well-Known Member

    Whilst I agree with everyone’s advice that self-defence is primarily about awareness and avoidance, I think Rmjim makes a fair point. (E.g. years learning boxing would likely be better than years learning tai chi.)

    However, I’d suggest that Rmjim reads Peter Consterdine’s Streetwise or Geoff Thompson’s Dead or Alive for a comprehensive answer.
     
  4. Pretty In Pink

    Pretty In Pink Valued Member MAP 2017 Gold Award

    I can't help but feel like there are slight flaws in Olympic TKD that make it less appealing. Padding and points make it awkward. I'd like to see sparring in a dobok and full contact where you are arectively trying to drop your opponent. You could make it so hands weren't allowed to be thrown at all.

    Like boxing but with legs.
     
  5. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool the merc with the mouth MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Isn't WTF full contact anyway?
     
  6. Pretty In Pink

    Pretty In Pink Valued Member MAP 2017 Gold Award

    Yeah you can win by ko but it's not the goal. The goal is mostly to out point your opponent.
     
  7. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool the merc with the mouth MAP 2017 Moi Award

    If you KO them you win though, it's just really hard to do straight away, just like you can't just go for the KO in boxing, of course noone tells the white collar boxers that!! Haha!
     
  8. Pretty In Pink

    Pretty In Pink Valued Member MAP 2017 Gold Award

    Yeah the problem arises with the vests that detect kicks and measure them rather than being scored objectively. I'd rather it was the same rules as boxing, but with legs.
     
    Dead_pool likes this.
  9. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool the merc with the mouth MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Olympic / amateur boxing or pro boxing?
     
  10. Black Wolf

    Black Wolf New Member

    OP you came straight out the gate with some "definites" that not all of us subscribe to (MMA/BJJ being the end all). It is understandable tho, MMA started as a "battle of the arts" and BJJ was pretty successful. Most don't realize how stacked the deck was in BJJ's favor tho or more importantly) how fast other arts addressed the gaps that were revealed.

    I understand what everyone says about the difference between fighting and self defense. I just disagree. I DO believe squaring off with someone, in a parking lot, often DOES fall under the category of "self defense" and try to make sure I have some coverage in that area as well.

    MMA and Muay Thai produces some VERY capable fighters. Physical conditioning is a huge part of the curriculum. Developing powerful strikes, sramina, and the ability to TAKE punishment. The combined total of these things normally equals an hombre I'm not in a hurry to throw down with. Two things to consider though: (1) How much of the arts effectiveness is due to that physical conditioning. Meaning - if a Hung Gar practitioner devoted that much time and effort to being that caliber of fitness, would you still see greater success out of the MMA guy? Make sense? (2) How much of the training is still useful, once you can no longer maintain that level of physicality? Will the techniques serve you well into your Autumn years?

    Also take your size and shape into consideration. You are a seriously big dude. Does training an art specifically designed to help smaller weaker people overcome a strength difference make sense?

    Then, even more out of the box - what art will have you coming back for more? If I went to a school that trained the deadliest most effective techniques and HATED everyone there, I'd probably become a better fighter at a TKD school that I missed on my off days.

    Every practitioner is different. What works for me might not for you and vice versa. Good luck on your path :)
     
    Mitch and Monkey_Magic like this.
  11. Pretty In Pink

    Pretty In Pink Valued Member MAP 2017 Gold Award

    Some good points. I would disagree that BJJ/MMA is better for more conditioned people. It makes you more conditioned though. Take me for example. Incredibly unathletic and pretty pathetic in pure lifting terms. I can still won fights against much bigger guys because of BJJ/MMA.
     
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  12. Monkey_Magic

    Monkey_Magic Well-Known Member

    Well said. It’s vital that you find somewhere you enjoy, because you’ll stick with it. Both the art and the specific club impact your enjoyment - find somewhere you like and will stick with.
     
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  13. Vince Millett

    Vince Millett Haec manus inimica tyrannis MAP 2017 Gold Award

    Most people are in locations where there is a limited choice or martial arts available and there's also a cost factor. We train in what's available.
    I'm lucky that my BJJ club has Muay Thai and K1 and wrestling included in the fee we pay. For those that can physically keep up, there's a lot of cross training available.

    Another question is why we train. I live and work in London. I haven't been in a street physical altercation since 1982 (ITF TKD saved my **** that time). Fear of physical attack isn't even on my radar. I'm no longer in the main target demographic - young men who get started on by other testosterone and stupidity-fuelled young men. So, although I have an interest in self defence applications of my BJJ (and the other arts I've studied), self defence is not a driving factor. Neither is fitness particularly. Heck, going to the gym hurts less if that's what I want.

    I realised that I train in jiu jitsu because I like jiu jitsu. That's it. I like doing it.
    I don't care that I can't punch as well as a boxer or throw elbows and knees as well as a Muay Thai practitioner. I dabbled enough in other arts that can throw a half decent punch but I like grappling. Most of us do the art we do because we like doing it.
     
    axelb, Dead_pool, Aegis and 1 other person like this.
  14. Mitch

    Mitch Lord Mitch of MAP Admin

    Doing something because you like it?

    It'll never catch on :D
     
    Simon, Mitlov, axelb and 4 others like this.

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