Why all the debating?

the person you're fighting is under those same rules and thus has the same disadvantages.

 

Said fighter more then likely trains to fight that way. I unfortunately don't so I personally wouldnt put my self in that situation.

 

ah. i see. completely understandable.
i'm always afraid i'll do something dirty in the ring when i get in the 'zone.' God knows i still kick my classmates in their cups as soon as it's available. that's the problem with "it' hitting all by itself.

 

Dae,

That's my biggest fear as well. I see an opening, I go for it instinctively. What's funny is that even before I started training in JKD, I was in a tournament and was sparring. I kicked a guy square in the nuts when he tried to do a jump kick at me. I was like wtf... Sidestep, rising front.. DQed.. I feel I won. =)

 

I'm pretty sure he was dominating them prior to that as well.

 

I dunno. I'm not sure that consensus is necessary. Maybe it's only necessary if one is trying to decide what "JKD" is/isn't. Would also argue that the consensus/principles are more of a problem because of context, than because of the usefulness of the idea.

Am not interested really in arguing what "JKD" is/ain't. We've been boiling things down to two ideas: "Does it work?" and "Thank you for your resistance." Tee hee.

BTW- I've been trying to make sapus and bizets (sp?) work, and I suck at 'em too, if it's any consolation. Good thing we have a couple great judo players in our band of malcontents.

 

Why didn't I see this before I tried to spell "bizet" (phai1) on my own. Oy.

 

Add Bill superfoot Wallace and Benny the jet and you should see that other guys were using what worked for them.

Not taking anything away from Bruce Lee but he was not the only one or first to use what was effective and discard what was not.


regards koyo

 

with Judo players around you might prefer the hip throw as well?! lol

 

Have you ever done a 'theme assault?' they are hard as heck for me to do. It's a great way however to break the habit of hitting with whatever tool is available. IF you would ever want to break that habit...lol

 

I'm with my friend here. Let's face it. An ippon Seionage doesn't follow the principles - you have to turn your back on them to throw it. A firemans carry throw doesn't follow the principles. You have to reach across the body to grab the leg instead of grabbing the near leg. I still practice them though.

 

Just to be clear, I'm not actually looking for a consensus. Or objecting to the debates. Just pointing out why they happen.

 

what i'm trying to say here is that when people pick and choose what aspects of jkd they want to use then claim to be teaching/using jkd. To each their own and thats every individuals choice but thats the biggest problem going on with jkd using the name just to make money.

if your doing what works for you great and thats what one should do but don't claim onething when your actually doing your own thing

yes lewis was winning prior to BL but he totally dominated after working with BL and has said it put him at another level

 

Exactly. Mike Stone, Skipper Mullins, Norris, the list goes on.

Really, I'd guess that anyone who's actively engaged in competition or intense sparring is going to be going through that process naturally.


Stuart

 

Dae,

If it aint broke, don't fix it.. =)

 

It seems counterintuitive to me to think that Lee would expect people to approach his ideas with less critical thinking and discernment than they would other people's ideas. Seems to me that he'd want people to be making these sorts of judgments about what he offered. And certainly about what others have offered since under the JKD banner.

But where's the threshold? Can you question nothing and be considered JKD? Can you question everything? What ideas do you have to accept? What premises are absolutely unquestionable?

I've read interviews with Lewis where he... how do I put this... placed much less emphasis on Lee's role in his success as a fighter.


Stuart

 

so to me what your saying is that an individaul can and should determine what aspects of jkd he/she sees fit to follow adding whatever they feel is what works for them and still call it jkd?

 

Well that's what I'm asking. Do you have to use jun fan-type trapping to call yourself JKD? Even though Lee appeared to have been moving away from trapping at the time of his death. Do you have to use the finger jab? If you're a subscriber to the Concepts approach, do you have to embrace silat? Or muay thai? Does the jeet tek have to be a prominent tool in your arsenal to be considered JKD?

If so, it would seem to me that JKD was even more dogmatic than most styles (which I don't believe). Nobody ever told me that I wasn't a taekwondoka because I didn't use a lot of jumping kicks. Or that I'm not Doce Pares eskrima because I don't use a ton of flicking witik strikes.

So are there precise criteria? And, if so, what are they?


Stuart

 

I think I have always respected Bruce for not being close minded about learning and studying various countries' MA. Especially back then. Not just learning 8 kinds of Karate for example. Realizing the answers to some martial arts scenarios could be in another style. He didn't have to be the first, he just had to bring that kind of thinking to the main stream. bravo-

 

there is a foundation to jkd and if your not doing it then plainly your not doing it. you can analyze, philosophise all you want but if your not true to the base then why claim to be doing jkd. yes it is an "art" that "honestly expresses the individual" but that does'nt mean add a little TKD, some BJJ, JJJ, Kenpo,Kali as you see fit and say i'm doing "my" jkd