what would be an example of a western martial art?

Discussion in 'Western Martial Arts' started by jordanblythe104, Feb 7, 2012.

  1. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    You ever heard of Paul Harris*?

    *Otherwise known by his alternate names of Rousimar Palhares, Treestump or "Toquinho"
     
  2. Gripfighter

    Gripfighter Sub Seeker

    no but that's an impressive amount of wins by heel hook, especially for a guy whos background is BJJ. will have to check him out cheers.
     
  3. Ben Gash CLF

    Ben Gash CLF Valued Member

    That heelhook against Massenzio was beautiful.
     
  4. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    He's worth checking out for all sorts of reasons.
    Every fight he's in has some weirdness of some sort (even his recent ADCC in Nottingham).
    He's the subject of several internet memes, some great gifs and he's truly a dangerous fighter and has a great back story.

    Example:

    [​IMG]

    And hannibal will love this reference...

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2012
  5. Langenschwert

    Langenschwert Molon Labe

    Indeed they did. To quote the so called "Dobringer" manuscript (HS. 3227a): "Alles fechten kommt von ringen" (All fencing comes from wrestling). Grappling is the foundational skill of swordsmanship.

    Also, most everything you see in koryu jujutsu is also detailed in the medieval and renaissance fight manuals... the same throws, breaks and locks were known by the medieval and renaissance knight.

    Here is the grappling from Fiore's manual of 1410:

    http://wiktenauer.com/wiki/Fiore_delli_Liberi#Grappling

    Best regards,

    -Mark
     
  6. Gripfighter

    Gripfighter Sub Seeker

    just watched that fight, really was a thing of beauty.
     
  7. LilBunnyRabbit

    LilBunnyRabbit Old One

    Worth remembering that at one point almost everyone in Britain was armed. Farmers would carry their longbows to the fields and rest them against the hedge while they ploughed, priests would carry daggers under their robes, and children would play fight with sticks and staves.
     
  8. Langenschwert

    Langenschwert Molon Labe

    Very true. Heck, I'm a German longsword guy and I made sure I signed up for Les Moore's Catch Wrestling seminar at WMAW 2011 this past fall. One of the coolest things I've ever done. Catch is awesome. You'll see a lot of the same stuff in BJJ (telephone series, etc) but nonetheless I heartily recommend getting some Catch instruction... effective and incredibly fun!

    Best regards,

    -Mark
     
  9. Langenschwert

    Langenschwert Molon Labe

    Asides from Catch and other living lineages, check out the following:

    [ame="http://www.amazon.com/English-Martial-Arts-Terry-Brown/dp/1898281181"]Amazon.com: English Martial Arts (9781898281184): Terry Brown: Books[/ame]

    [ame="http://www.amazon.com/Lessons-English-Longsword-Brandon-Heslop/dp/1581607342"]Amazon.com: Lessons on the English Longsword (9781581607345): Brandon B. Heslop, Benjamin G. Bradak: Books[/ame]

    [ame="http://www.amazon.com/English-Swordsmanship-Fight-George-Silver/dp/1891448277/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1328714059&sr=1-1"]Amazon.com: English Swordsmanship: The True Fight of George Silver (9781891448270): Stephen Hand: Books[/ame]

    Best regards,

    -Mark
     
  10. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    Britain was instrumental in the development of western boxing.
     
  11. Mitlov

    Mitlov Shiny

    Going back to to the original question, I'm not sure that "Western Martial Arts" or WMA, as the term is traditionally used, really encompasses everything that's being listed in this thread. So sure, BJJ is from Brazil and boxing is from Western Europe and Olympic freestyle wrestling is from Europe...but none of these arts are actually discussed with any frequency in the WMA forum.

    Seems to me, literal interpretations aside, that "WMA" typically refers to Western traditional martial arts, where modern sport competition is not the primary focus and there's some attempt to recreate training methods or techniques as they were historically used. i.e., historical pugilism, ARMA and other historical swordfighting, folk wrestling, etc. Would people here agree that that's what they typically are referring to when they say WMA?

    (Which means that this isn't really the right forum for an Olympic-style fencer, but ah well, none of the other forums really fit either).
     
  12. Ben Gash CLF

    Ben Gash CLF Valued Member

    I try to use HEMA to describe those arts, and WMA to cover the broader spectrum, as that would be more accurate.
     
  13. Polar Bear

    Polar Bear Moved on

    Perhaps in certain periods of great unrest like the Anarchy but it certainly wasn't a general rule. Since 1066 Britain has had arms control laws which were set up by the Norman aristocracy to control the Anglo Saxon peasantry.
    Everyone carryed a knife because it was your general purpose eating implement.

    The Bear.
     
  14. Johnno

    Johnno Valued Member

    There was a time during the middle ages when it was the law in England that every man had to practise archery, so presumably they would have had their own bow. Off the top of my head I don't don't know how long that was in force.
     
  15. LilBunnyRabbit

    LilBunnyRabbit Old One

    It still is.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/10300924

    You can also be fined if you have a son over seven years old and have not provided him with a bow and arrows.

    Other signs showing long ties between the English and the bow are in our skeletal structure (the two bones in your left forearm are 1-2mm thicker than your right, a legacy of 30 000 or so years of archery).

    Sadly the King's pardon no longer applies, and if during archery practice you accidentally shoot someone walking past you can actually be prosecuted.
     
  16. Ben Gash CLF

    Ben Gash CLF Valued Member

    I believe that law came in under Henry VIII, so renaissance rather than medieval. Edward I made a law banning all sports except archery on Sundays though.
    LilBunnyRabbit, the bow didn't really enter British military circles until the Norman conquest, where it was used with devastating effect. Even then the longbow and it's significance to British military tactics didn't come to the fore until after the Welsh campaigns of Edward I, and the subsequent integration of Welsh archers into English armies.
     
  17. Ben Gash CLF

    Ben Gash CLF Valued Member

    The Assizes of Arms (1252) required all "citizens, burgesses, free tenants, villeins and others from 15 to 60 years of age" should be armed, at least with a halberd and a knife, and if they owned land valued over £2 a longbow as well.
     
  18. Johnno

    Johnno Valued Member

    And I thought I'd done everything for that lad. Seems I was wrong.

    Probably not in MY left forearm. My forebears were more likely to have been the ones being shot at!

    I'll try to bear that in mind.
     
  19. Polar Bear

    Polar Bear Moved on

    *Sigh* this is why in history you have to understand context is everything.

    During the rein of Henry the third there was a chap called Simon de Montfort. Take a walk round Leicester and you'll see the name alot. He wanted to reassert the magna carta and give more power to the barons. King Henry was quite partial to absolute monarchy. Long story short. In 1252 De Montfort was aquitted of oppression charges Gascony by English lords and was offered the Regency by French Lords. Henry knew that if he accepted it would mean war between England and France. Hence the Assizes of Arms 1252.

    Look at the list of people. These are effectively the middle classes and up.



    The Bear.
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2012
  20. Ben Gash CLF

    Ben Gash CLF Valued Member

    Villein's hardly middle class though, and I appreciate the motivation behind it.
     

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