US cop and highschool student altercation

I'd call this pretty clear excessive force as there are other less dramatic ways to get a student out of that chair - but my question here is not 'was this excessive force?' But 'was that cop not trained in non-violent compliance/restrain methods?'

If the cop was not trained in appropriate compliance methods (like the british MAPA ( http://www.crisisprevention.com/en-uk/Specialties/MAPA-Management-of-Actual-or-Potential-Aggressio ) and when to use them, then it's the department's fault in my opinion, not his.



http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-34650484

 

Without seeing the pre-arrest dialogue it's unclear if the officer's communication skills were up to par but I'm preemptively calling this... Nonsense!

When an officer successfully makes an arrest people are going to mistakenly view it as excessive force. Why? Because the officer uses sufficient force to overcome the resistance of the subject. That will always look violent to those not trained in making arrests.

The officer in this case got the student out of the chair and to a space where cuffing was feasible. The officer did nothing which would cause undue physical harm in the course of the arrest and none was caused apparently (I'm fairly sure the article would've reported that).

This seems to be a case of white cop + black arrestee must equal racism.

And honestly, what other "less dramatic" ways would you get someone out of a chair, away from the desks, and into handcuffs, who doesn't want to do any of those things?

 

We've no idea what lead up was, but I didn't see the same as SWC Sifu Ben at all.

Firstly, what was she being arrested for? I was under the impression she had merely refused to leave class.

Secondly, it appears to me that the cop was trying to lift her from her desk, and when it came with her, lost control for a second and was lucky she didn't injure her head or spine.

How you can call that a successful outcome for anyone involved baffles me.

 

Cops are good, anyone the cops are beating on is bad. Didn't you get the memo? And dark skin is +2 to badness.

Give the man a medal.

 

That may be possible. I'm viewing it on a small screen so it's a little hard to make out exact details. I'll trust your assessment until I can see better for myself.

 

Its pretty bad - there's no way that you can argue the force was proportional to the threat the girl (who was sat behind a desk) posed.

 

It didn't look sped up at all to me. What makes you think that?

 

He didn't restrain her, he grabbed her around the neck, tipped her backwards out of her chair (incredibly dangerous) and then picked her up and threw her across the room. If that is the best he can do, then he isn't fit to do his job. I don't think this was racism, I think he'd have done the exact same to a white student and it would have been just as much an outrageous reaction.

I've just rewatched the video a few times and there is nothing to suggest to me that the video was sped up.

 

Poor UoF, terrible tactical choice and clearly well beyond the requirement to acheive the stated end of removal/arrest

 

Yeah that was excessive. Unjustifiable levels of force.

 

I'm curious about how you would have gone about it - its no doubt a tricky situation.

 

I'd agree with that, though I don't have the same experience you do.

How would you have attempted to handle it though if someone was resisting whilst seated like that person was?

 

I once worked in a mental hospital and both received training and used physical restraint techniques.
What the cop could have done is secure her arms/arm and gently lower her (and the chair) to the ground, then use his body weight to pin her. If she became compliant once out of the chair he could lead her out using an arm lock.
If he needed to, he could have gotten someone else to lay across her legs if she was kicking and somehow flexible enough to reach him whilst he was laying across her upper body (very unlikely but I've had to do it once).
Once she was on the ground a big guy like that could easily role her over into whatever position he needed - or call a teacher/student to help pin one of her limbs whilst he did whatever.
The cop could have even handcufffed her whilst she was still sitting - he was clearly much bigger than her physically.

The point is, I could have restrained that student in a non-harmful way. I've helped restrain far more agitated people, once someone wielding a piece of broken glass. That cop had the added advantage of being quite a it bigger than myself too.

I tried a brief search to find some videos of the techniques in talking about but gave up after a few minutes - I'm sure someone here will confirm what I'm saying.

 

The most telling action for me is when he literally throws her across the room. That shows the disparity in size and strength and I think is indicative of anger and frustration.
I've some sympathy with how tricky it could be to get someone out of one of those desks with any degree of success but that throw was unnecessary and clearly excessive.

 

I just got the chance for a second viewing on a bigger screen. Wow. Dump the chair with her in it and toss her across the room.... I thought he was just pulling her out of it and dragging across to where there were no desks. That was ridiculous tossing a youth around like a sandbag. :bang:

 

Definitely more than was called for. Usually can't tell from a video that short but here it's pretty clear. Getting her out of the chair if she doesn't want to go might be tricky but nothing indicates any physical resistance on the video and even with some resistance, that dump backwards looked pretty unnecessary.

Definitely looks to be outside the scope of reasonable force based on the video.

Hell, a straight armlock to lead her out of the chair and to the ground would likely have covered it even if she wanted to pitch a fit and refuse to be cuffed. At least then the risk of her being injured is directly proportional to how vigorously she resists.

And I don't know the details but wasn't this a case of her refusing to give up her cell phone in class? I'm no expert on laws on student subordination to teachers and faculty (beyond truancy of course) but that doesn't strike me as a police issue.

 

I used to work with teenagers with behavioural difficulties in an institutional setting. Restraint was frequent. The amount of times I wanted to do something like that were innumerable but you simply can't as its unjustifiable from a moral perspective if nothing else (especially when attempting to model positive behaviours to troubled yoots dem). Cop lost his cool, potentially not for the first time it seems.

 

Apparently, the whole ordeal was over her chewing bubblegum in class.