Traditional Boxing

Discussion in 'Western Martial Arts' started by Louie, Sep 20, 2004.

  1. Louie

    Louie STUNT DAD Supporter

    Old Boxing Techniques

    This old print of bareknuckle fighter, Tom Sayers, shows details of some of the old boxing techniques of the day....

    The illustration bottom left, with both fighters grappling, shows Sayer performing a leg lock/trip, forcing his opponent's head back with the elbow...

    The illustration bottom right shows Sayer moving in with his face fully covered behind the elbow guard, using the elbow against the opponent's ribs.

    The illustration middle right shows punching the opponent's face while holding him in a headlock (This technique was called nuist in Scotland)

    Sadly the quality of the scan prevents a proper examination of the techniques

    Louie
     

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  2. Esgrimador

    Esgrimador New Member

    A very interesting thread--congrats to everyone who contributed, especially, of course, Louie.

    I might add my 2 cents in a bit...
     
  3. Louie

    Louie STUNT DAD Supporter

    Sayers Elbow Cover!

    An enlarged detail from the Tom Sayers print, shows the boxer moving in with his face hidden behind the elbow... The point of the elbow being used against the opponent!!


    Louie
     

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  4. Louie

    Louie STUNT DAD Supporter

    Leg Locking

    An enlarged detail from the Tom Sayers print, shows the boxer using a leg lock, wrapped around his opponent's leg. Although not entirely clear it looks like the elbow is used against the jaw or throat to force back the opponent's head!


    Louie
     

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  5. Stolenbjorn

    Stolenbjorn Valued Member

    This is like taken directly out of the Fiore manual for wresteling! I think that Fiore would prefere to have his leg on the outside of the opponent, but this will work just as fine -protect ones groin as well! This is so cool; keep it coming!
     

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    Last edited: Nov 29, 2004
  6. Louie

    Louie STUNT DAD Supporter

    Straight Punch

    An enlarged detail from the Tom Sayers print, shows the boxer's straight punch coming over the top of his opponent's cross-guard!


    Louie
     

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  7. Louie

    Louie STUNT DAD Supporter

    Cross Guard & Side Step!

    Another detail from the Sayers print, possibly shows the defending boxer avoiding a straight punch by side-stepping combined with the cross-guard close to the face... normally the guard-arm would whip out, striking the attacker with the backknuckle!!!!

    Louie
     

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  8. Louie

    Louie STUNT DAD Supporter

    The Chancery!!!

    Sayer again, using a neck-lock or 'Chancery Hold' while punching the opponent's face... His lead leg moving into position for a possible cross-buttock hip-throw!

    Louie
     

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    Last edited: Nov 29, 2004
  9. silksword

    silksword New Member

    i dont think bnb is anywhere near as evolved as chinese martial arts.
     
  10. DEATHskull

    DEATHskull TKD Bearfighter

    LOL, now if that wasn't trollish, I don't know what is.
     
  11. silksword

    silksword New Member

    simple opinion. bnb is cool, but i wouldnt say that any martial art evolved from it. besides boxing.
     
  12. davethekodiak

    davethekodiak Valued Member

  13. Cudgel

    Cudgel The name says it all

    you defination of martial art muct be flawed in some respect. bnb is a martial art.
     
  14. nForce

    nForce Banned Banned

    I am a traveller who doesnt travel anymore but alot of my family do.

    I have many cousins who are bareknuckle fighters, and my 2nd cousin until he became a reborn christian was as you put it 'the king of the gypsis' (lol) but yea he was the best, he beat every gypsy and traveller who he fought. i have a couple of videos of lots of fights and could very easily get hold of ALOT of videos of bare knuckl fights between gypsys and travellers.

    Theres alot of money in it.
     
  15. Louie

    Louie STUNT DAD Supporter

    Hi Enforce
    I believe that there is a distinct connection between the old pugilists and the King of the gypsies/traveller/fairground fighters which modern (sport) boxing has lost.

    Did your 2nd cousin do a christian tour that involved Scotland? I remember reading about someone with a similar story in a local paper....
    It would be very interesting to meet him and see the videos.

    You are in a great position, you should take up and preserve this stuff before it disappears to pass it on to future generations!!!


    Louie
     
  16. nForce

    nForce Banned Banned

    I'm not sure becuase ive only met him a couple of times, but he did travel around scotland england wales and ireland

    this was many years ago now, like 20 years ago

    his name is dan rooney

    i have many other cousins that fight, but among travellers he is regarded as our best, my uncle which lives up here has around 4 videos (all old from 70s-80s) but all my travelling family from ireland and londen have alot more which i could get if asked

    ive even had the experience of seeing many a fights, at weddings etc

    you gotta remember any dispute between travellers is sorted out by bareknucle fighting, only do some get paid like £20 etc, and thats arranged fights
     
  17. nForce

    nForce Banned Banned

    Oh and dont worry about being prserved, all travellers will keep stuff like this, its just that you country people probably wont ever see it :( which is a shame, but it is thought as just a gypsy travller thing
     
  18. ocianain

    ocianain Valued Member

    Great thread! BKB has a long and convoluted history. Keep the posts coming please!
     
  19. Louie

    Louie STUNT DAD Supporter

    Targeting vulnerable areas....

    Like modern martial artists and their Asian counterparts, the early boxers targetted vulnerable areas of the body, in this famous fight the boxer Cribb won the fight by punching his opponent in the throat...

    "Rural Sports, A Milling Match Took Place at Thisselton Gap in the County of Rutland Septr. 28 1811. between Cribb and Molineaux on a 25 foot Stage and was the second Public contest between these two Pugilists. It lasted 19 Minutes and 10 Seconds and went in favour of Cribb."

    Two boxers are surrounded by a boisterous crowd. In the seventh of 11 rounds, Cribb struck Molineux on the throat and he fell. This moment is portrayed here, as Molineux's seconds (assistants) react with dismay while Cribb's cheer.

    Louie
     

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  20. Louie

    Louie STUNT DAD Supporter

    More vulnerable areas....

    Another look at WMA targetted vulnerable areas of the body, in a famous ancient Roman pugilist match, one of the fighters uses a thrust with his fingertips into his opponents armpit, killing him on the spot!

    This statue from the Vatican shows the fighter with his rear hand ready to thrust....

    Louie
     

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