The trapping hands myth

Discussion in 'Jeet Kune Do' started by Monkey_Magic, Apr 10, 2018.

  1. Grond

    Grond Valued Member

    Whatever. Stop claiming the old school glory mantle, unless you put up a video of yourself schooling some Kung Fu students up right this second, I won't ever read a thing you say again with trust.

    Go ahead, try the grumble grumble internet Fu arguments again. The dead horse is you my friend. Time to wake up.
  2. aaradia

    aaradia Choy Li Fut and Yang Tai Chi Chuan Student Moderator Supporter

    He is just participating in a discussion forum. You know, what we are here for?

    I could be missing something, but he isn't claiming to be an instructor or trying to sell his school. I understand the demand for video proof if it is an instructor. However, we should be able to have a discussion with differing opinions and not have the conversation stilted by the demand for video posts.

    One can want to participate in discussion and not want to post videos. It is ok. Posting videos is not required.

    And you are perfectly free to have your opinion without that video proof as well.

    I am just saying I hate when debate and discussion gets shut down in demands for video evidence. It isn't required to have an opinion and join a discussion on MAP.
    Callen and Grond like this.
  3. Grond

    Grond Valued Member

    Don't waste your time with posters like Icefield. They do nothing but whine and complain and contribute nothing to discussion but their own pathetic, lonely, biased, selfish natures.

    In before his next snarky, forgettable, disposable reponse and weak moderator action.

    Websites like this are dead, because of posters like him, not like us.
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2022
  4. Grond

    Grond Valued Member

    I wasn't going to get into this again, but I have to say how disappointed I get logging in and seeing someone claiming martial arts superiority (like Icefield does often) to someone who is not only friendly and conciliatory, but has an opem mind.

    I've met Wing Chun fighters in the last 22 months who would turn Icefield into jelly. But without video, he'll never believe it?

    Talk about deluded. Spending decades posting about how other people think they know the Kung Fu, but na, only he does, because something about under a bus and

    Get out of here!

    (But not you Aaradia, you are the best and I regret even having to drop my opinion so bluntly, but I did try to keep it clean this time. Next time is a toss up).
  5. icefield

    icefield Valued Member

    Are you still mad I disagreed with swayze being the best fighter Benny the jet ever trained and a master tai chi practitioner ??
  6. aaradia

    aaradia Choy Li Fut and Yang Tai Chi Chuan Student Moderator Supporter

    Mod Note: I have asked the mod team to take a look at and monitor this thread for several reasons. In the meantime, with that in mind, I am going to ask everyone to take a deep breath before posting and make sure they are following TOS. Let's be polite, no personal attacks, no trolling, post in the environment as mentioned in our TOS. Be welcoming to our new members.

    I am off to train soon. I would really like it if I don't come back here after that and don't need to lock the thread until the mod team can look at it. Ok?

    Have a good evening everyone.
  7. aaradia

    aaradia Choy Li Fut and Yang Tai Chi Chuan Student Moderator Supporter

    Mod note: Ok. Nevermind. I can see where this is heading even as I was posting. Thread locked for now pending Mod discussion. I don't want to have to come do a massive cleanup when I get back from training.
  8. Mitch

    Mitch Lord Mitch of MAP Admin

    That whole video is an awesome breakdown.
    David Harrison likes this.
  9. Mitch

    Mitch Lord Mitch of MAP Admin

    Play the ball folks, not the player. There are too many long time posters here who have valuable contributions to make to MAP, I'd like to see healthy debate rather than mudslinging and bans.

    @Yanli, I notice you use, "sensei" as a term whilst referring to CMA. I have essentially no experience in CMA, but I have always associated sensei with Japanese arts. I'm curious as to why you use it?
    axelb, aaradia, bassai and 1 other person like this.
  10. Callen

    Callen New Member

    From my experience, the methods in which a practitioner utilizes chi sau (黐手 sticky hands) can have a direct impact on how they understand the Wing Chun system in general.

    Chi sau (黐手 sticky hands) isn't really about maneuvering your opponent's hand so you can trap him, and it isn’t a technique. It is a training conduit for the concepts and principles of the Wing Chun system, a drill for honing reflexes and actions. Chi sau trains to free the arms from obstructions and maintain the attack. It develops automatic responses for chasing center when blocked out or entangled by an attack, it teaches to never chase the hands. Training chi sau can also be thought of as a way to let the opponent show you how to hit them. These attributes are fueled by the Wing Chun maxim, ‘Lat Sau Jik Chung’ (來留去送), which shapes how the system is trained, implemented, and understood.

    Wing Chun at its core is more a way of training for fighting than it is a group of techniques or pre-determined answers.
    I don’t disagree with you that trapping can be an effective tool in a fight, but in Wing Chun, trapping is never the goal. The goal is to hit, not to chase the hands. Ever.

    Trapping is simply one part of the whole, it is a single byproduct of all the mechanics found within the entire Wing Chun system. If the way is clear, hit. If the way is blocked, clear the way and hit. Angling for position, hands on top, controlling timing and distance, utilizing proactive footwork, attacking the attack (截 jeet ), dang gerk (蹬腳 lifting heel kick), etc… All of these Wing Chun actions and mechanics are driven by the same concept of ‘Lin Siu Dai Da’ (連消帶打), simultaneous attack and defense. And just like trapping, each of them are but one part of the same whole.
  11. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    I'm glad they had the slo-mo, that guy is crisp!
    Mitch likes this.
  12. Mitch

    Mitch Lord Mitch of MAP Admin

    He's sooo quick :D

    I think it's interesting to see breakdowns like that because it shows the use of many of the ideas contained in many TMAs in a real-time environment. I'm sure some will disagree, but I see kata movements and ideas also found in karate and TKD there, though often those arts have lost the use of them. But the parries, slaps, and subtle movements of boxing seem to me much closer to what the "blocks" of many TMAs should be.

    I'm wombling off into another subject there, apologies for the thread drift.
    axelb, Grond and aaradia like this.

Share This Page