The K is on the Way

Discussion in 'Karate' started by SPX, Nov 21, 2012.

  1. SPX

    SPX Valued Member

    Why is that?


    Sounds positive. I can say that the stuff I've watched over the last few days wasn't bad, in my opinion.


    I love TKD but I'm kind of with you. It's often times just not a lot of fun to watch.


    I also think that if it's crowd interest the IOC wants then Karate would probably do better in that regard. There's only one way to find out, though.


    Yeah, the real question is, Does TKD have to go in order for karate to get in?
     
  2. Fish Of Doom

    Fish Of Doom Will : Mind : Motion Supporter

    eh, aghayev is pretty cool. i really like the fact that he uses bobbing and weaving, which a lot of karate people hate. i've heard about the contact thing, but haven't seen any examples of it, and to be honest, if they don't fix the judging so that the competitors are actually doing karate, it's not likely to do much, because unless you literally drop guys with a single tsuki done at its proper range (which most WKF comps wouldn't count as a valid technique), there'd be little to no advantage in power shots vs the standard long range flailing they do.
     
  3. SPX

    SPX Valued Member


    Oh, you mean this guy. I guess what he's doing there could be classified as "bobbing and weaving" but to me it just looked like he was not very good.

    Nice finish, though.




    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l3aF0kzxY_A"]Rafael Aghayev - Kumite Eliminatories 2012 World Karate Championships - YouTube[/ame]
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 26, 2012
  4. slipthejab

    slipthejab Hark, a vagrant! Supporter

  5. slipthejab

    slipthejab Hark, a vagrant! Supporter

    What's his background? Boxing. Good fast twitch movement - feints, slips, rolls, bob and weave. The guy might make a good boxer! :D
     
  6. Fish Of Doom

    Fish Of Doom Will : Mind : Motion Supporter

    have you ever been punched in the face?
     
  7. SPX

    SPX Valued Member

    Sure. Why?
     
  8. Fish Of Doom

    Fish Of Doom Will : Mind : Motion Supporter

    because if you have then you'll surely see why what he's doing is useful in a setting where you don't even need to be TOUCHED in the face to be scored against.
     
  9. SPX

    SPX Valued Member

    If it works for him, then okay. But there's a reason bobbing and weaving doesn't carry over well to martial arts involving kicks (and knees, though not applicable in this case I don't think).
     
  10. Fish Of Doom

    Fish Of Doom Will : Mind : Motion Supporter

  11. Mitch

    Mitch Lord Mitch of MAP Admin

    One problem would be that the Olympics would promote the kind of cagey matches we've seen in TKD. In the match above, to the uninformed viewer, nothing happens for almost a minute, there's a quick flurry, then it's over. Without a deeper understanding of what you're watching it's just not that interesting.

    One of the selling points of the Olympics is that it interests people who are not already devotees of a particular sport. Any layman can watch boxing, hockey or whatever and get a pretty quick idea of what's going on.

    Mitch
     
  12. Moosey

    Moosey invariably, a moose Supporter

    You seemed to be saying that shotokan clubs would benefit disproportionately from the fame of WKF karate. I'm not sure why that would be the case as, traditionally, shotokan sparring has been non-point-based in the dojo, for training, and done using shobu ippon for competitions rather than the 9 point system (or whatever it is) used in the WKF.

    Although WKF has become very popular in recent years, I would hazard a guess that it's still less popular than JKA style competitions in shotokan clubs.

    I'm not so sure. I think light contact continuous sparring doesn't work as a competitive format. It encourages more odd, unsafe, and unrealistic tactics than one-point kumite, where there's a more palpable sense of danger. For training, light continuous with minimum rules is better, but not for sport in my opinion.
     
  13. Blade96

    Blade96 shotokan karateka

    Gotta agree with Mitchy here. :) I watch the olympics every 4 years.
     
  14. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    The next "combat" sport to be added needs to be MMA-esque. All other aspects are already pretty much covered and adding another "angry pyjamas" style will not do anything to grow or promote the art.

    For me it would make sense to add Pancrase/Shoot rules - those matches were and still are technically solid and do not degenerate into "rock em sock em" quite so frequently as UFC matches.

    I remember arguing the semi-contact (a la "Clash of the Titans" style) would have made for a better spectacle than TKD (which to be blunt bores the bum off me in the Olympics) because they punch AND kick. If karate or something similar did want to get differentiation then scoring punches properly would be a good start
     
  15. Mitch

    Mitch Lord Mitch of MAP Admin

    Do you think the Olympic Committee would go for that? I don't see it myself, I think it would be perceived as too "brutal" now.

    Mitch
     
  16. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    That's why it needs tweaking to the Pancrase style - open hands etc

    "Pure" MMA (if that is not too much of an oxymoron) would be a hard sell I agree; modified less so. The old UWFi/Bushido rules would be ideal actually
     
  17. Zinowor

    Zinowor Moved on

    Why not just BJJ?

    I'm not particularly fond of seeing sweaty men in tight shorts sliding all over each other trying to get the other guy in a lock.

    However with a Gi on, it is much more watchable. Also for younger people.

    People complain about the pajama's, but I think the average person ignorant of MA would cringe at the sight of that tight shorts deal.

    BJJ seems to me, the most viable grapple art for the Olympics.
     
  18. Mitch

    Mitch Lord Mitch of MAP Admin

    Honestly? No. BJJ is people rolling around on the ground.

    I love BJJ. The bits I've done were great and I'm currently working out if I can join a gym to train several times a week during the day.

    But it's a phenomenally detailed and technical art which, to the uninitiated, looks like blokes rolling around on the ground. Not even rolling that much actually.

    You and I know what it is. But the general public will just think it's "silly."

    I watched an Olympic TKD bout with my in-laws recently. It ended with a knockout by a spinning kick. Pretty exciting huh? No. It was a lot of working position, setting a technique up, etc etc.

    We re-watched it with me pointing out foot position, body position, some similar basics that I understand whilst by no means being an expert on it. They got a lot more out of it as a result but still weren't really following and not for want of trying.

    Now transpose that to BJJ, which I respect hugely (apart from the uniforms, I mean, c'mon! :D). I just hit youtube and typed BJJ. The results I got, under the heading "Greatest BJJ match ever was [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7DLFqLCFqg"]this[/ame].
    Honestly, given a non MA audience, with no appreciation of grappling, do you think this will be popular outside BJJ practicioners, never mind MA practicioners?

    Mitch
     
  19. Zinowor

    Zinowor Moved on

    I'm not a fan of grappling, I just thought it would be better than the tight shorts version with striking. Most of those fights end up on the ground anyway, so I would prefer having them wear a Gi if I was going to watch at all.
     
  20. SPX

    SPX Valued Member


    That's an interesting point. I guess it's kind of true, though to me the karate matches seem a little more interesting because of the wider variety of techniques used and ways to win.
     

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