Supposed "knock-off" versions

Discussion in 'Kuk Sool' started by unknown-KJN, Mar 22, 2010.

  1. Pugil

    Pugil Seeker of truth

    Wallace was a giant of a man [it was really funny having Gibson play the part], and he'd have needed to be to wield that thing! I wonder if they let Mel try to even lift it! :D
     
  2. KIWEST

    KIWEST Revalued Mapper

    Hmm try doing Juhng Guhm Hyung with that baby...or better still get two and try Ssahng Juhng Guhm Hyung!
     
  3. KIWEST

    KIWEST Revalued Mapper

    Anyone ever watch Monty Python?
    Remember this?..."Is this the room for arguments?"
    "NO!"
    "Yes it is there is a sign in the door!"
    No, it isn't"
    "Anyway you're not arguing, you are just contradicting everything I say"
    No I'm not!"
    Etc etc etc
    Thats what we need..a room for (pointless) arguments and then the rest of the forum. But I wonder if we will ever agree which arguments are pointless? LOL Maybe the MODS could keep an eye on things and when they feel things have got out of hand they could just dump the whole thread in the "arguments room"
     
  4. Obewan

    Obewan "Hillbilly Jedi"


    No we don't! :cool:
     
  5. Bruce W Sims

    Bruce W Sims Banned Banned

    Yes, we do. Besides, Obewan, you're not really arguing. You're just contradicting what he's saying!

    Best Wishes,

    Bruce
     
  6. Demdike

    Demdike Banned Banned

  7. Yi-Sun-Sin

    Yi-Sun-Sin Valued Member

    waste bandwidth...
     
  8. Hyeongsa

    Hyeongsa The Duelist

    i wish to publically apologize for my random ass post. it seems (after re-reading it) that i was NOT entirely in my right state of mind and posted this while...well...not thinking. lol
    sorry if i caused any confusion or un-needed hostility.
    Bruce, i'm gonna make another thread where you can explain, in depth, your sources on why you think Kuk Sool doesn't add up as the "Korean Martial Arts" of korea, and why you think its not as "authentic" as you think it is. i'm not being snippy, i'm being serious. you have me slightly intriqued since i did a little further research (thanks to Out-To-Lunch). i'm not buying all of it, but i would like you to explain your thoughts. if you don't mind, that is.

    anyway, a martial artist must be able to admit his mistakes (or dumbass posts, in this case. lol) since at first dahn we're taught humility. sorry MAPers!
     
  9. Quozl

    Quozl Valued Member

    Hey Hyeongsa, we all can have a brain-fart, and go off on one. No biggy, and hopefully all good now.

    See, Tartan has soothing qualities as well as looking great and manly when worn by a hairy jock!
     
  10. Bruce W Sims

    Bruce W Sims Banned Banned

    I think that would be a really worthwhile project. Count me in.

    Best Wishes,

    Bruce
     
  11. MUSOOLJOHN

    MUSOOLJOHN AKA KUKSOOLJOHN

    Should be a good read if we keep to listing facts and not bicker!
     
  12. unknown-KJN

    unknown-KJN Banned Banned

    Actually, Bruce, I already found some good stuff you had said about all of this on the HKD forum (not the HKD section of MAP, but the separate website: www.hapkidoforum.com).

    It was an exchange you had with Mike Dunchok (and ImaJayhawk was also involved) which I copied a little less than a year ago, and the posts were contributed in Sept. of 2006.

    However, the link I copied for it is now broken (the forum no longer uses a subdirectory called "phpBB3"). Needless to say, despite finding threads which do go back to 2006, the one I'm referring to is curiously absent (thank goodness I copied it). For anyone interested, here's the link to the "kuk sool" section in that other online bulletin board:




    I believe I copied the entire thread and it really isn't all that long IMO, but it is a bit lengthy to be inserting all of it here, so I'll need some time to sort through it and bring back the pertinent bits of info. :cool:
     
  13. Bruce W Sims

    Bruce W Sims Banned Banned

    Probably as good a place to start as any. Lets let people digest that information and we can take it from there.

    Best Wishes and thanks,

    Bruce
     
  14. Obewan

    Obewan "Hillbilly Jedi"

    So Bruce your a moderator on that form? Who'd you have to pay?:fight1:
     
  15. unknown-KJN

    unknown-KJN Banned Banned

    Huh? Are you looking at the same website? The only person I noticed on there that has any such clout, that also posts here occasionally in the KS section of MAP, is Thomas Morrison (who includes a link to the HKD forum website in his MAP sig file BTW).

    You can tell that Bruce isn't a moderator on that forum because Admin names appear in RED, Global Mods appear in GREEN, and Wiki is set to BLUE. FWIW (the Legend explaining that is clearly marked at the bottom of the page)
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2010
  16. Out-to-Lunch

    Out-to-Lunch Valued Member

    I think that Obe was referring to the HKD forum as a whole and not just the Kuk Sool subsection :cool:
     

    Attached Files:

  17. unknown-KJN

    unknown-KJN Banned Banned

    Proven wrong AGAIN! :bang:
     
  18. Pugil

    Pugil Seeker of truth

    Way to go OTL! :D
     
  19. unknown-KJN

    unknown-KJN Banned Banned

    From my saved file of a deleted HKD forum thread:



    There's more, but this is a good start, I believe. When I first looked at this text file, I thought it was the entire thread, but upon closer inspection, it seems as if I picked it up midstream. No matter, the important stuff (by my POV) was captured. Almost everyone participating is also active here on MAP, using ths same screen names (except for Mike Dunchok, whose profile can be found here).
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2010
  20. Bruce W Sims

    Bruce W Sims Banned Banned

    Master Mike Dunchok wrote:

    Actually, Hwarang Do and Kuk Sool Won come from the same source, along with a third martial art called Kuk Sool Kwan. That source was the Kuk Sool Hwe, the first Kuk Sool gymnasium in Korea which was run in the 1950s. There, as Korea sought to reclaim a national identity after the Korean War and 40 years of Japanese occupation, various masters who had trained under Choi Yong Sool's new hapkido and who had also had training in various older "native" Korean martial arts gathered to practice and develop a "national martial art".

    No, in fact In Hyuk Suh and the Suh family did not create all of Kuk Sool. Much of the forms come from the white crane and praying mantis kung fu that had arrived in Korea a few centuries earlier, the hapkido parts are from Daito-ryu Aikijujutsu from Japan, and the rest is truly from the the Gong Jong Mu Sool. However, many more grandmasters deserve credit for the creation of Kuk Sool as an art, including Kang Ik Jo, Kim Chun Soo, and most especially Kim Woo Tak, a grandmaster quite senior to In Hyuk Suh...



    OK. Lets start here

    I accept that CHOI Yong Sul and his HAPKIYUKWONSUL had input into KUKSOOL WON. I will even stretch the point a bit and accept that what is predominantly a Japanese practice came back to Korea and was “Koreanized” courtesy of the collaboration between CHOI Yong Sul and SUH Bok Sub. As I say, it’s a stretch but at least it is documented.

    Now, where is it documented that there were “native practices" and what were the origin of these practices? If, we are talking about SIB PAL KI, I can accept that because that practice is documented, but then SAY THAT. By comparison there is the reference to White Crane and Praying Mantis. Where is the documentation for THIS? If the Korean military was using Northern OR Southern White Crane or Praying Mantis where is the documentation? If the forms arrived in Korea “a few centuries earlier where is the documentation? How did they come to Korea? Who brought them and from where?

    I am not particularly interested in the in-fighting between the HRD and the KSW. What I am waiting for is someone to document what they are saying. Comments?

    Best Wishes,

    Bruce
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2010

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