Hi there, haven't been here for a while, haven't trained for a while neither... I shall go back to training soon! Anyway, it seems like some discussions are just recursive, before people asked what's the practicality of forms, today I see a thread here about how "trad stuff" helps in a fight!! But has anyone wondered about the other way around? Does sparring help you to perform your pattern better? Or how can you improve your form? What differentiate good form from bad, just look into a mirror and judge if it "looks" good? Yes I enjoy doing patterns A LOT. I don't know why, it is just fun.
Sparring helps develop your balance, speed and coordination which can also help you in your form. I think from the technical aspect, form allows your to get the moves right without external pressures of avoiding being hit. People tend to rush and be sloppy to get the strike or block done in time. Sparring isn't likely to help with your development of good techique but it is great for learning to put good technique into practice.
point sparring usually has the matched stopped to announce points and/or is light or no contact. "regular" sparring is harder and more or less continuous.
Sparring is where you put what you learned into practice. You don't learn to swim without getting in the water, and you don't learn to fight without getting on the mat.
Sparring let's you develop all thwe interactive components of making a tehnique work, timing, distancing etc. You can only really develop these working with someone else, in a reasonably open, resisting way (i.e. sparring, whatever the ruleset you work to) Without these attributes, you can't apply tecnique, no matter how perfect your form (i.e. a perfect front snap kick done solo can look flawless, perfect body mechanics etc. but taking that and using it against someone trying to kick you is a very different thing) It is also where things that make sense on paper fall apart (i.e. big blocks with the reaction hand pulled back to the hip may seem credible as blocks, until you test it against someone in 'live' sparring. Then you may wish to re-examine their purpose)
I'd say in good patterns, the movements flow and must appear effective. I think this is something one is forced to practice with sparring. There is a feel to making contact that you can imitate in pattern so it almost looks like you are fighting someone. That makes it more interesting to do and watch. And on the flow, in sparring the rhythm is kind of irregular and bursty. Patterns look good when the rhythm reflects how the moves would be used in sequence. I love the idea of thinking about how sparring improves forms! Great question. I'll think about it today in training.
Point sparring for me is the most boring thing in MA, when i first started on karate i used to compete a lot in point sparring competition. I win some i lost some but i never felt like it was worth nothing, each time there is a punch or kick everything is stopped to evaluate if there was a point or not. When i switch to TKD WTF it was amazing because the fights where from semi to full contact and 1 minute to 2 minutes each. Has for the question well i really dont know if sparring can do anything for forms because in TKD WTF there are no forms.
To understand my answer take into account that I hold that forms are useful only if used as a mnemonic to remember self defence moves (applications), and only if the self defence moves are drilled with a resisting partner. As long as there's a good ruleset, I find sparring helps me work out what applications I manage to pull off, and therefore what has a chance of working and why. For example last week I had been playing around with a throw that I use as an application. When I tried to apply it in free sparring I was just repeatedly pummelled. As a result its now back to the drawing board to see if I can work out a better set up for the throw, as practising it how I currently do it doesn't really seem to work that well. But the real emphasis above is on the ruleset - currently I feel, especially in WTF TKD but also to a large extent in ITF stuff, that 'sparring' in the gym is pretty much synonymous with 'tournament sparring'. The issue here is that because the concern of the students becomes how to score points under the tournament rules, sparring becomes a completely separate discipline to forms (and of course in competitions you frequently do get entrants who specialise in doing forms or sparring). In this sort of situation I don't think that sparring helps forms. But if the rules become either freer, or specialised (say attacker can strangle the other defender, the defender does what they can to break it) then sparring becomes the testing ground for techniques. I feel the trick to using sparring to help forms, unless thinking in purely sporting terms (in which case forget it), is to not think of them as separate - if you have a partner then train with a partner (this is sparring), but if you are on your own then practise the same techniques against an imaginary opponent (this is proper form practise). Really? Do you not practise Taegeuk/Palgwe 1-8, Koryo, Keumgang, Tae Baek, Pyong Won, Sip Jin, Jitae, Cheonwon, Han Soo and Ilyeo? Or are you in it solely for the olympic style sparring? If so, does you school gives grades without the practise of forms. (I'm genuinely interested here! I've heard many people say that many WTF black belt competitors don't know forms, but never have I had a concrete example.)
Yannick35 said that point sparring is boring and I understand that opinion. My previous schools used point sparring and I say I really had more fun! I find it more educational because one gets prompt feedback about what works and what doesn't. We sparred the same way in class and gave each other feedback or acknowledgement for points that should've scored. After 2 minutes of continuous sparring, if you won you really don't know why; you don't know if the score was close or big or little. What I don't like about (stop)point sparring is when matches acquire sacrificial techniques. Lunging forward leading with a fist works if you know the action (and the danger) stops as soon as you land one technique. Then there's this silly "scorpion stinger" technique where a competitor dives forward past his opponent with his leg reaching up (imagine a scorpion's tail) behind him toward a surprised opponent. It doesn't matter he's face down on the floor...he got a "point" and the action is stopped.
Nice, at least one person like forms enough to admit they like this thread! Seems like most people see the word "sparring" and jump straight into how important it is for a martial art. That I agree for the most part... and I understand that form is not everyone's thing... however I think it is a fun thing to do and is a good tool for people who like to incorporate into their training. Like, in sparring, you don't really have time to think about or even look at your technique, you just do thing out of second nature. It is great because you got the pressure and you can really find out what is effective and what isn't... However I do not think sparring is the be all and end all, in sparring you might have did a otherwise good technique, but because of pressure, time, lack of use in sparring, it turn out to be sloppy and uneffective... that doesn't mean the technique isn't good, but just when you haven't got the hang of it... drills can help practise these techniques, when you think about how it works, how it can be used in sparring, or rather if you find yourself exposed when executing this technique; and overall, try to improve a technique, so when you go back to sparring, you can try out your improved technique, which in sparring itself may improve your technique even more, since you have put it in use and see how it really works. I guess I am saying they are practises that can complement each other... I mean, if you find a straight punch effective in sparring, then how can you build on top of that, and make that punch even more useful? Can drills, forms, and such help you?
