Scott Sullivan Home Study Muay Thai course.

totally agree.we shouldnt forget them.but it use should not be emphasised much.

i dont think you can compare a spinning elbows and side kicks, of which are both very effective to the techniques i quoted earlier-spinning backfist and spinning back kick.the latter 2 techniques take a lot of effort to do, leave you very open and are very hard to accurately connect.

 

getting back to a bob and duck.
i think its use also depends on your height in relation to your opponent.
if you are taller, it wouldnt be advisable to bob/duck but more parry and slip. bobbing would be easier if you were shorter, but why not have lateral head movement instead with slipping??


I dont think there is enough head movement in muay thai these days.more lazy blocking/covering up,head blocking.there should definately be more head movement.but lateral movement with slipping/parrying punches not vertical/bobbing/ducking.
theres no place for bobbing as its more effort to apply,leaves you open for attack, and there are better alternatrives- slipping.

 

I think this is a great discussion because it tells the many differences in mt. Not every school or fighter is the same, nor is mt taught the same things the same way calling it the same names. There are many school that specialize in different things. For example, there is a mt instructor in england name master sken. I like what he does. His mt looks different than bangkok style.

I just wanted to share those thoughts.

 

Rab,

Sken incorporates Tae Kwon Do into his MT teachings. Very pretty, very effective.

 

I think Sken is a 5th dan in TKD

 

a lot of mt purists/traditionalists wouldnt class Master Skens style as muay thai really. its a different style. same with Toddy and Woody.

 

My Kru trained under Master Sken and was only mentioning his tkd last week but didn't get specific details.

 

Is that to do with bringing it over here and adapting it to the UK audience?

 

Boxing is really predominate over here, I've found. Some of our fighters stand side on, because they box alot, less to hit, but easier for someone to take their leg away.

It depends on your opponent. I find it's good to train in both Western Boxing techniques, and Thai Boxing techniques, and try to judge when you can use them. Obviously, it takes a long time to be proficient enough to know though.

 

and 5th dan in muay thai.

 

This is a great discussion and i'm glad i mentioned it now. I think that criticism has been levelled at muay thai in the past for the fact that their fighter's heads are too static and many of them have been trying to adopt more western boxing techniques. So I think it's at least valid that MT gyms EXPLORE the potential use of western boxing head movement in their training.

The gym i trained at in Thailand is Sinbi muay thai. I've trained there 4 times now for a total of about 9 months or more. Sing (sinbi) fought in k-1 korea and they train a number of k-1 max fighters at that gym so I suppose it's not ALWAYS strict traditional muay thai. There's bound to be some other influences that creep in because of the k-1 background. With that in mind, they also do spend a fair amount of sparring sessions on boxing (no kicks allowed at all). Sing himslef has amazing head movement and I don't think i ever managed to land a clean punch. Ever.

However, having also said that, the trainers that worked on bob/weave etc with me were not k-1 fighters but were lumpinee/radjadamnoen ranked fighters and were raised in strict Muay Thai gyms in bangkok. So they've obviously been schooled in this somewhere.

However, I really must emphasize again what has been said in earlier posts. NONE of these trainers EVER suggested that bob, weave, roll etc should be a major part of a muay thai fighting strategy. I only believe they worked on this with ME because my head is probably unnaturally static and it's a weakness in MY game which could lead to me getting tagged badly. They worked on it with me but only occassionally and probably only after they noticed that i was so bad that it needed some work!!!

 

Didnt think there was a dan grading in Thai, especially in Thailand?

Good point on the lack on head movement in Thai though. This is were just a good solid boxing session should help. I was watching a fight in Thailand and although the lad was winning the fight during one round he took so many punches to the head i was thinking he was gonna get caught out.

From watching it i find the footwork to be lacking sometimes. Although there nothing wrong with stand and trade, movement is great defensive tactic which doesnt seem to be played on all that much. Im not saying it aint taught, it just dosnt seem to be used all that much.

 

This could lead us on to a very interesting point,what is our definition of Muay Thai? as an example Muay Thai in the 1960s is very different to Muay Thai in the year 2009,when I started in the early 1980s it was different again,bring in the Older Muays styles such as Muay Chaiya,Muay Lopburi etc and its different again.

I bring up this point mainly because in the 1960s the footwork was fast,the evasion including ducking etc was used more,the pace was sooo much faster,the clinch wasnt used anyway near as much,shin/knee blocking was hardly used,combinations were used more,the boxers didnt de-hydrate as much as now etc etc.

So what is Muay Thai?..my instructor said to me when I asked him this same question...Its just Thai people fighting! dont fuss over the name!

 

sorry yatezy
my comment was a bit tongue in cheek.as in master sken didnt actually fight or train any mt fighters in thailand but did in tkd and his system of grading here with 5th dan students etc.

good point what is muay thai.

 

Great statements!

My Muay Thai coaches fought in the 50's, 60's, and 70's. My coach who fought in the t50's and early 60's showed that There was much more emphasis on Western Boxing skills and active footwork. Evasion was an artform in much the way modern clinchwork is an artform. Slipping, Leaning, Ducking, Sitting. Bob n Weave? Not so much....

And speaking of clinchwork... It was very basic. It was SOLID, but basic. Double-neck tie, Body Lock (double-underhooks), and a basic throw from each position. We did spend time each training session practicing clinchwork, but very few of the techniques were 'refined'.

Now, my coach who was fighting in the late 60's and 70's started to divulge from this trend. His footwork was not anywhere near as elusive, preferring to constantly move encroach on his opponent. He was not a proponent of head motion particularly, but the guys guard was darn near impregnable! He made the use of Len Muay, Taad Mala, and Taad Mala Kwai guard positions to an artform! I have seen him go toe-to-toe with fighters who are 1/2 his age, twice his size, and in great condition. I can't think of a single person who has landed a clean shot to his head..... EVER!

The clinchwork he taught is still not very refined, but he was able to help me begin to bridge the gap between clinching using only the basics and beginning to adopt modern clinchwork. He introduced me to a few variations on clinch "positions", counters, and attack angles.

It's funny because with the huge variety of fighting styles that contributed to Muay Thai the Fighting Sport, its kinda disappointing that we no longer see a huge difference in the actual fight styles. The gyms all copy one another... if they see something that works, they adopt it for themselves!

And I love the quote about Muay Thai just being Thai's fighting Thai's.... in a weird way, it reminded me of the time I approached my Muay Thai coach and asked him to begin teaching me the traditional Thai names for the techniques. He just laughed at me and said: "Call the techniques whatever you want, that's what we Thai's do!"

Now that I have actually studied some authentic Muay Boran, I have found that this is true.... everyone has their own names for the arts, the techniques, the strategies.... It just doesn't matter. All that matters is that you can do them well.

(sorry for going off on a tangent, I return you now to your regularly scheduled program....)

 

Good post Khun kao,

Did your Ajarn that used tat mala etc come from a Muay Chaiya background?.

My teacher is from The north but his teacher was from Lopburi,his name was Pol Prapadaeng,a very famous boxer with a lot of Mae Mai and a top class Ram Muay Hanuman dop yung.

 

fire cobra.... see PM

 

KhunKao,

I will reply to you on a pm soon,Ive just ran a promotion over the weekend and as Im sure you understand have had my head up my backside for weeks!.

 

Awesome! I know EXACTLY what you mean.... I'm actually being forced to take a break from promoting events myself.

How did your event go? Got pics?

 

I knew you would understand! you have to run them to understand what stres they can be dont you!,It was only a amateur event,we had 20 fights and it went well,I had 9 boxers on 3 lost 6 won all good contests so im happy but shatered!.

If I can work out how to put pictures up Ill do it before I go to Thailand(next week!)

Mail you soon bro.