Remember the twitter Robin Hood airport thing?

Discussion in 'Off Topic Area' started by Slindsay, Jan 30, 2012.

  1. Kuma

    Kuma Lurking about

    Great thinking, but I doubt it'll work that way. Depending on the legal systems of different countries, you could have no criminal record to speak of yet be well versed in all manner of illegal and dangerous activities. Not to mention you don't necessarily need a criminal background to be a danger to someone. If you look at the background of a lot of lone wolf terrorists and the like, they may have had disciplinary problems as kids but rarely ran afoul of law enforcement.

    I guarantee if some idiot college student Tweeted "Goin' to London and the Buckingham Palace - can't wait to blow that place UP!!!" and MI5 caught wind of it, he wouldn't be enjoying tea and crumpets in merry old England. He'd receive a similar treatment and, on their decision, be allowed entry or refused.
     
  2. slipthejab

    slipthejab Hark, a vagrant! Supporter

    Your overstating your case here. My guess is this doesn't make more than a blip of a dent in tourism... if even that. I expect most Brits aren't nearly as daft as hipster boy and my guess is that it changes nothing. It's not like all of a sudden the US is out $120+ bn. :rolleyes:
     
  3. Kuma

    Kuma Lurking about

    I actually don't think this is worse than the Paul Chambers/Robin Hood Airport incident though. Chambers was actually charged, convicted, and lost an appeal over his silly Tweet.
     
  4. holyheadjch

    holyheadjch Valued Member

    This one incident might be a small blip, but this isn't a one off. If these kind of things start to add up, and now that the media knows they're onto a winner, any future instances will be reported, then you get to a point where the US gains a reputation for being unfriendly to tourists. That isn't a good thing.
     
  5. slipthejab

    slipthejab Hark, a vagrant! Supporter

    Meh. The US is always an easy target - that's hardly news. The British press is never going to take it easy on the US in this regard. I don't think a single story in the Daily Mail is going to have some deeply profound effect on the economy.

    It's an unfortunate incident all the way around. The dumb ass who, caught up in his fervor to be stylish and party and let everyone know about it and the rather somber and dry Homeland Security Dept. who hauled him in and then booted him out. They're custom made for each other. The emo haired and the high and tights... one big happy party of the worst ends of the spectrum. :p
     
  6. holyheadjch

    holyheadjch Valued Member

    That was no less a ridiculous decision.
     
  7. slipthejab

    slipthejab Hark, a vagrant! Supporter

    I'd never even heard of that incident... but jeez... are these people living in a vacuum? Do they not realize that current (last decade) climate towards jokes that could be construed (however tenuously) to be terrorist threats?

    Have they not seen what happened on 9/11? Did they not live through the IRA bombing campaigns in London? Were they absent from the world during the likes of Columbine and other such incidents? Do they not read the papers about plots that have been foiled precisely because the Feds and other dept's have been tipped off by social media? /rhetorical

    It's basically tantamount to being asked to stop by a cop and then reaching for the toy pistol in your waist band. Then crying up a fuss when you are shot saying your were only reaching for your gun as a joke. Unreal. Completely clueless. And it seems.... totally unaware that social media... is just that. Social. It's not private.

    Here are some recent examples of exactly how pitched the climate is for this type of 'joke'.


    source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4chan

    source: http://www2.tbo.com/news/breaking-n...following-bomb-threat-to-workplace-ar-347870/

    source: http://www.wptv.com/dpp/news/region...rges-of-making-fake-bomb-threat#ixzz1l6nZ0tJg


    This just scratches the surface. The tiniest amount. So you'd have to be a flat out idiot to post about blowing anything up on a social networking site. Yes there is a slang usage context... but surely one can't be completely ignorant of the goings on around the world.
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2012
  8. slipthejab

    slipthejab Hark, a vagrant! Supporter

    more:

    This particular scenario.... joking while boarding a plane, going through customs or dealing with airport personnel has to have happened at least a dozen times in the last few years in the US alone... always resulting in an arrest or a detainment. People don't learn... it's not just the yanks who take it seriously... obviously down in Oz they have a threat management program that takes it seriously as well.
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2012
  9. slipthejab

    slipthejab Hark, a vagrant! Supporter

    they take it seriously in the Philippines:

     
  10. slipthejab

    slipthejab Hark, a vagrant! Supporter

    it's never ending... so it's rather plainly clear just how bomb jokes are taken by most authorities.

     
  11. John R. Gambit

    John R. Gambit The 'Rona Wrangler

    Yeah, it was a stupid thing to say but I somehow doubt that daft twit in the photo had any concept that his slang would be taken out of context like it was. In order to consider that plausible, one would need to have an awareness about the world necessary to realize the scope of the echelon program in NATO, and that certainly doesn't look like the couple featured in that photo. I doubt it crossed his mind that Americans were even considering reading his stupid Twitter updates.

    And it is slightly ironic that while the issue of making stupid declarations in a public space (Twitter) is obviously unwise, had it been private email or a private phone conversation, echelon may very well have also picked up the chatter and the results would have been quite similar.

    Kuma, I think the presumption on your part that the aviation authorities acted appropriately in their job duties is something frequent flier savvy MAPers might take exception to. Especially travelers on (general) American airlines. It wasn't that long ago that we had TSA agents sticking their hands (without an underwear barrier) all over the genitalia of passengers, meanwhile local state authorities were standing guard in airports waiting to arrest said TSA agents for sexual assault.

    And honestly, next to the porno scanners and free prostate exams being offered at major American airports (in some cases still are), how bad for American tourism can this whole British twits story really be? I mean is any other country on the planet routinely groping the genitals of passengers during standard security screenings? Has any country besides us ever done so?

    Finally, let's face it; maybe they won't target an airline but America is not much safer from terrorism than it was before 9/11. Are our ports anymore secure? Our land borders? We're paying a very high price for a modicum of improved security while at the same time encouraging people to live in a state of fear that is the terrorists' primary motivation. We're more at risk from ourselves than we are to terrorists.
     
  12. holyheadjch

    holyheadjch Valued Member

    Slip, this wasn't a guy making a bomb threat. This was a guy who made a joke about partying that DHS chose to take out of context.

    Again, should a nightclub refuse entry to anyone who tweeted that they were going to 'tear up the dancefloor'? That's the level of threat we're talking about.
     
  13. slipthejab

    slipthejab Hark, a vagrant! Supporter

    Well as you can see from what I've posted the current climate regarding posts with that type of language can lead to unexpected repercussions and if you expect law enforcement to be able to decipher hipster context then I think you're asking way too much in most cases. Again I don't say it's right... and if you've read what I posted it's obvious that I also feel it was taken out of context... but in this type of a climate it's not all that unexpected. That was the whole reason behind posting what I did... take a look at the number of incidents where the person was obviously joking... and they still got taken down or hauled in.

    I've no doubt that the law enforcement and Homeland Security are under orders to never treat it as a joke. It'd be like treating a gun as possibly unloaded and therefore I can be a bit more lax... instead of treating every gun as loaded until the situation is under control. Sorry it just doesn't work that way.
     
  14. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    From my perspective I have no issue with taking it seriously, but that cannot be at the expense of correct investigative techniques. 10 minutes with the idiot in this story would have revelaed he is just a bit of a neo-lout mouthpiece not an international terrorist.

    A few hours in the slammer, slap on the wrist for being dumb and welcome to the US would have been better than just sending him back for graveyard desecration
     
  15. holyheadjch

    holyheadjch Valued Member

    So the nightclub example I posted - you'd refuse them entry?
     
  16. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    Who me or slip?
     
  17. slipthejab

    slipthejab Hark, a vagrant! Supporter

    My guess is you don't actually follow the subject much. The reality is a very different picture.

    source:

    more here:
    http://www.heritage.org/research/re...mbating-complacency-in-the-long-war-on-terror

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_foiled_Islamic_terrorist_plots_in_the_post-9/11_United_States

    http://thf_media.s3.amazonaws.com/2011/pdf/b2604_chart1.pdf
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2012
  18. holyheadjch

    holyheadjch Valued Member

    you can both take a shot if you like.
     
  19. slipthejab

    slipthejab Hark, a vagrant! Supporter

    and FWIW - constantly at MAP I find myself in the ironic position refuting misinformation by having to use facts and figures collated by ultra-conservative right leaning think tanks. Sheesh. :(
     
  20. slipthejab

    slipthejab Hark, a vagrant! Supporter

    Why would I even need to respond to the nightclub example you posted when I'm perfectly capable of discussing the actual incident itself?

    I find most arguments by analogy to be rather fallacious.

    But since you are set on using it... your analogy in particular breaks down because there hasn't been a trend of people going to nightclubs with the actual intention to physically 'destroy' or 'tear up' the dance floor. So it's a rather poor analogy. We can see from what I've posted that there has been a trend for some time now of people making threats on social media like Twitter and Facebook and to a certain extent YouTube... that have actually panned out or have been quashed by the authorities before they could come to fruition. Further more the incidents that were most likely just jokes - traditionally haven't been seen as that by authorities. They do not view this type of subject as any laughing matter. Which is where I then use an apt analogy (the loaded gun one) to make my point as opposed to trying to make some sort of round about argument.

    So if you wan't to make an argument it helps if it's apples to apples and oranges to oranges. Bad analogies don't really move the conversation forward.
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2012

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