This is something that always fascinated me. There is usually a lot of talk about inborn ability and god-given talent and whatnot, but what is the actual science behind it? I get how a powerful punch works, but it's a mechanic that anyone can do with practice. But what is it that sets people apart? Obviously there are height and weight differences that set people apart, but what about when the height and weight are completely the same? Body fat percentage as well as muscle volume. There is still going to be a difference in the power of their punches. But I'm interested in what makes one person have a more powerful punch than the other. If there is a scientific reason behind it I'd be interested in reading about that. I'm sure I'm not the only one who finds this interesting.
It's a mechanic as you said, but it's not a simple one. The skill to put all your body behind your punch needs a lot practice and can make all the difference in the world imo. Some focus on it while some others focus on other fronts and make use of their strong points such as speed and physical strength to hit.
There are so many variables that go into it. The people who reliably have the more powerful punches are the ones who reliably synch all those variables up with one another. This is probably still not an exhaustive list of the variables at play (aside from those you already mentioned): 1) Timing: Landing the punch as the opponent is off balance, off guard, stepping into it, committing too much weight to has back foot, raising his chin, etc. 2) Footwork: Good punchers often aren't just generating force with their arms, hips, and legs. Their foot placement and the momentum of their step INTO that placement also lend force to the punch. 3) Series: Punches in bunches. Sometimes it's the cumulative effect of punches, even if it looks like a single punch was the "closer." 4) Targeting: Landing a shot in the right place is going to obviously affect how the punch is felt by the other guy, which ultimately determines which one was "more powerful." 5) Angling: Sometimes, it's a matter of a couple of degrees that determine whether a punch puts someone on their backside or not. A fighting stance usually involves one foot being placed behind the other to lend stability. But with a quick change in the punching angle, the force of that punch might send them back over the space where there is no bracing leg. The result being a lack of balance and a tumble. I think this is why smaller skill sets often result in more obviously effective fighters. It's mastery of these variables that mean the difference between landing a technique and not. The best aren't the best because they have the experience to seamlessly blend all of these things together in the heat of the moment.
I think some people just have that certain attitude and put everything into a punch with more abandon than other people. So everything is firing at once, muscles, CNS and emotion all together. Naseem Hamed for example always seemed to be putting everything he could into a hard punch.
I appreciate the effort, but I already know about this stuff. What I'm talking about is measurable power in lbs or kg. You're talking about knockout power, but it's not the same thing even though they're related. I can see where you're coming from, but I have to disagree completely. You make it sound as if everyone has the same power output, but only those with the right mentality will use it. I believe that punching power is as much an ability as it is to sprint really fast. A product of a certain body type if you will, but I'm wondering if there are certain key elements to the human body that will cause someone to have a more powerful punch. Or if it is just a full package deal that your whole body should be taken into the equation when calculating power output potential. Perhaps if you'd want to get the most accurate prediction possible, but I'm more interested in the main contributors. Isaac Newton stated in his 2nd law that acceleration*mass=force. That would be the mechanic of the thing. However this law doesn't quite cut it for calculating the force of a punch. There is a certain element of recoil. The recoil takes away the force of a punch, because a punch is not a real punch without follow-through. Recoil could be noted as deceleration or something like that to make it a measurable unit in a math formula. So now the math formula would look like this; acceleration*mass=force, force/deceleration=punching force This is a really crappy hypothesis obviously, but you should be able to get what I'm saying. Anyway it would make sense that if we could somehow reduce/remove the recoil, it would result in more punching force. Perhaps the strength of our arms, shoulders, abs come into play here. But I could be overlooking something, so I made this thread.
The ratio of fast twitch to slow twitch muscle fibers would make a difference. Eye hand coordination would be a big thing as well. And if your talking about punching a person who is moving about verses punching a stationary target then visual acuity will make a difference. I think there are simply too many variables to determine a good measurement for punching power.
I know I talk about measurements and stuff, but I'm way more interested in the variables. Especially interested in knowing if there are any prominent variables and what they are.
Picking the right father and mother would be first then. Genetics is probably the first deciding variable. Right genes, no skills = probably can hit pretty hard even with a wild haymaker. Wrong genes, good skills = you can hit harder than you could but genetics will limit the power. Right genes, good skills = we have a winner.
lol this is what i meant That's so vague...! Genetics is like chi? I guess some things are still a mystery to us
Not vague at all. Think of sprinters. Anyone can run a sprint, with training anyone can run a sprint faster but only certain people will have the right body type, optimum mix of fast twitch and slow twitch fibers and the right mental attitude to be willing to put up with the training required to reach elite levels. Same with punching.
Again many variables but I find alot of people do not put their weight behind their punches relying on upper body mechanics. Boxers hit hard as they learn from day one to put weight behind their punches without overextension. Big factor and I have seen many MA'ists who do not grasp this concept and think turning their hip without sinking their weight and correct upper mechanics alone = power. Padwork/bagwork is also important in learning power generation and I am often amazed at how many clubs do not practice this regularly. Cheers Dan93
I was going to argue against it, but then I realized I didn't know all that much about slow and fast twitch muscle fibers, so I read this article about it. http://sportsmedicine.about.com/od/anatomyandphysiology/a/MuscleFiberType.htm I'm not sure how trustworthy the website is, but it seems fairly legit from this and other articles. I can actually connect all the dots in my head now about this subject. I was looking at this all wrong, I thought there were going to be some major contributors to this phenomenon called punching power. I was thinking of certain body parts and stuff, but now when I think about it, probably every muscle that you contract during a punch is going to be a major contributor to its force. So it's much simpler to just look at it from a fast and slow twitch muscle fiber standpoint. So thanks, I learned something interesting today. :hat:
There is still the skill portion of punching. By learning to punch correctly you can increase your punching power a lot but there is always that ceiling based on your muscle composition. So, get a good boxing coach to teach you how to punch. You might never be a Mike Tyson but you can learn how to hit hard. When I trained at an MMA gym for submission grappling I spent some time in the boxing class to learn how to punch better. My boxing skills still suck but I can hit harder.
Yeah uhm, I'm a karateka. I did a couple of months of boxing and I practice on a heavybag at home, but that's as far as I'll go. If anything, I'm actually thinking of cross training in Judo because it seems fun and I can do it at the school I do karate. So yeah, I just sometimes get really curious about things and that's when I usually start bothering the people on this website.
Measurable punching power has to be about both strength and technique. Strength comes from muscle mass and ratio of fast/slow twitch muscle fibres, as above, but technique lets you use what strength you have in the most effective manner. The whole body will be contributing to the movement to some extent, which adds to the power. Timing the movement of different parts of the body correctly makes them all make their contribution at the same time, and good technique also means you only use the muscles you need to use, and don't slow it down by tensing the antagonists.
