[POLITICS] Why doesn't he call an election!?!?!

Discussion in 'Off Topic Area' started by BigBoss, Jun 3, 2009.

  1. BigBoss

    BigBoss This is me, seriously.

    So we are in the depth of recession, there is huge public anger over the expenses scandal and with another minister resigning today it is clear that even his own party have lost faith in him. Why doesn't Gordon Brown just get it over and done with and call an election??

    I really don't understand his think. Yes according to all polls he would loss an election if he called one now, but he only has a year left before he HAS to call one and what does he think is going to happen in that year!? Does he really think that in one year we will be back to high growth and low unemployment, that he is somehow going to learn how to be charismatic and people are going to start liking him, that everyone is just going to forget the embarasing u-turn on the Gurka issue, that people will forget the expenses scandal and his bad handling of the whole affair!?!?

    The fact is he is going to lose whether he calls one now or in a year (btw I am not saying this as a conservative supporter, in fact I have no party allegiances and last time round voted lib dem) why doesn't he put the country and himself out of misery and just get it over and done with!?

    I really am just wondering what his motivation is for holding on. Do you think its a kind of Machiavellian clinging to power? Or to you think he really thinks it will all turn around in just 1 year?
     
  2. Gary

    Gary Vs The Irresistible Farce Supporter

    Political parties are well known for cleaning up their act in preparation for an election, unless he's forced to there's no way they'll call one early. You'd be surprised how much people can forget in a year!

    On a side note the current european elections are annoying me, every party seems to have adopted at mud slinging campaign consisting of a lesser of two evils approach. I want to vote based on what a party will do, not on what the competition will do.
     
  3. BigBoss

    BigBoss This is me, seriously.

    I completely agree about parties cleaning up their acts prior to an election and the public is fickle. But the point is, this situation is not going to get any better in a year. According to the vast majority of economists and economic commentators we wont be on our way out of this recession in a year. There is literally no way we can begin to make a dent on our huge national debt in just a year. And Gordon's own cabinet seem to have lost faith in him and some political commentators this morning are even predicting a possible leadership contest!!!

    Basically things aren't gonna be getting any better for Gordon in just 1 year. I would love to get inside his head and see what he is thinking and why he doesn't just end it now and save everyone, including himself, more pain!
     
  4. Llamageddon

    Llamageddon MAP's weird cousin Supporter

    One more year of employment.
     
  5. holyheadjch

    holyheadjch Valued Member

    Why the hell would he call an election? As you've said, he'd probably lose it, how's that for motivation? There's a saying: A week's a long time in politics. Well consider how long a year is.

    Gordon Brown doesn't need to win us over, he just needs to leave it as long as possible in the hopes that the Tories will screw it up. It would only take a moment for Cameron to undo all the work he has done.

    Also, the Gurkha affair was mainly Jacqui Smith's fault. The expenses scandal was a fault with parliament in general and none of the leaders of the main parties have been damaged by it personally. Brown has been pushing harder than anyone for changes to MP's expenses so he can't carry much of the blame on that issue.

    Brown can turn this around with a bit of luck (a war in the south pacific would be useful about now) and some intelligent politics. He's plenty smart enough to do what needs to be done, but he needs to be bold.
     
  6. Mushroom

    Mushroom De-powered to come back better than before.

    Remember when Brown first got into the office? He was challenged for an election and at the time he was on a high so he accepted. 6 weeks later he turned out to be not the leader we wanted and quickly cancelled the election..He's been just about surviving since.
    This whole expenses incident has been a boon for him as its taking a lot of attention away from himself personally, while the current favourite to be next PM Cameron has been hit the most negatively with Brown fanning the fire.

    Brown has a year to to turn this all around for himself. He either has to come up with or execute what hes planning that will garner enough popularity and keep it running. Remember, a candidate doesnt need everyone to agree, just enough.
    However he is grasping at straws of trying to be popular (commenting on the Britians Got Talent show didnt do him any favours).

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7032192.stm
     
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2009
  7. cloudz

    cloudz Valued Member

    He waited so long for power and to step out of Blairs shadow. I don't expect him to let it go so easy. he'll hang on as long as he can.. personally i can't stand him, most of the mess in Britain is his doing anyway - Goddamn *******. No boom and bust my ass!

    And he sold off our Gold reserves..
     
  8. BigBoss

    BigBoss This is me, seriously.

    According to a poll carried out, Labour had came out the worst from the expenses scandal. Whether that is deserved or not isn't really the issue, fact is most people see labour as the worst of a bad bunch when it comes to expenses. I would hazzard guess that it is cos Cameron came out faster, harder and more public about reforms and getting his own party in to shape. Top of that Brown has been prime minister for 2 years and was chancellor of the exchequer for over 10, more than enough time to push through change, or at least bring about a couple of serious debates on change if he really wanted to.

    Whether you support Labour or not I really don't think you can argue that Brown can turn this around. Some polls have him behind Cameron by 20 points!! On top of that he is on the verge of a coup from his own cabinet! I honestly think there is no chance for Brown to win the next election. To be honest I think Labour have very little chance to win, but there chances are even lower with Gordon as the leader and I think they know it, which is why we are seeing resignations and rumors about his own party getting rid of him
     
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2009
  9. BigBoss

    BigBoss This is me, seriously.

    This simply is not true taken from politcshome website about the result of their extensive poll:

    "Overall, seventy six percent of voters think that Brown is doing a bad job, while only twenty three percent think he is doing a good job.

    In contrast, David Cameron and Nick Clegg have reached the highest recorded ratings by PoliticsHome for their leadship performance. They stand jointly on thirty one.

    The results suggest that although all parties have been affected by expenses revelations, the Prime Minister is bearing the brunt of public anger."
     
  10. slipthejab

    slipthejab Hark, a vagrant! Supporter

    Oh the irony it all...

    Apparently this whole scandal over expenses for the MP's in Britain was actually brought to light by an American woman. If not for Heather Brooks tenacious efforts to obtain what should have been open public record the British taxpayer would still be paying for MP's husbands pornos, second homes, maids, pond ornaments and the whole nine yards.

    Why is it that it took a woman Yank to bring this out in the open!?!? :D
     
  11. BigBoss

    BigBoss This is me, seriously.

    Slip you just reminded me that there are probably a few Americans here reading this who aren't familiar with British politics. As such I have to post this http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b006nldz fast forward to about 7 mins in, when it gets good ;)

    Thats todays prime ministers question time, some the PM goes through every wednesday. It is the sole reason why I think British politics is probably the most interesting in the world. Weekly, open, no-holds-barred, debate!!! Not a speech, not pre-planned, but alive combat!!

    Can you imagine if every week Gorge Bush had had to go through a similar thing with his opponents!! The amount of Bushisms would have been brilliant!!
     
  12. BigBoss

    BigBoss This is me, seriously.

    I don't really see why it's ironic???

    That woman is a journalist and activist and yes was integral in bringing the expenses scandal to light. How is it ironic, or even that strange that it is an American woman!? Britain is a cosmopolitan country and are media is staffed with many non UK nationals.
     
  13. holyheadjch

    holyheadjch Valued Member

    Not true, there was never an election, it was all media speculation, once an election has been called I dont think it can be cancelled.
    The expenses scandal has hurt Labour badly because whilst Brown has come through ok, a lot of his cabinet members have been caught out.

    Actually I think a lot of people were impressed by his willingness to comment on BGT. It's a show of humanity that he hasn't previously demonstrated.
     
  14. holyheadjch

    holyheadjch Valued Member

    It's not an issue for the Prime minister or for the Chancellor. It is an issue for parliament as a whole. Why would they look to change the system when it worked so nicely for them. Make no mistake, the only reason we are hearing about changes at all is because their expenses have been made public.

    I used to support Labour rather avidly, but I dont think I'll be voting for them at the next General Election. I've found myself disagreeing with their policy decisions more and more and I think it's probably time for a change. I imagine I'll vote Lib Dems because I just can't bring myself to vote Conservative.

    But dont be naive, Labour can turn this around, 20 points sounds like a lot, but at this distance from a general election, it isn't. A couple of high profile Conservative screw ups and that gap will vanish quicker than you can say 'David Camerons a toff'.

    As for the resignations - this has nothing to do with confidence in Brown - no one takes a £30-40K pay cut because they dont like their boss. They are resigning, because they were going to get booted in a reshuffle next week anyway. They're just trying to save a little face.
     
  15. Southpaw535

    Southpaw535 Well-Known Member Moderator Supporter

    I don't want the tories in so i'm happy for him not to call one. If UKIP start getting higher in the polls then call it
     
  16. BigBoss

    BigBoss This is me, seriously.

    Well you did say
    So I assumed that you meant that "Brown has been pushing harder that anyone for changes". So if you first say that he has been pushing for change, then you say it isn't an issue for the prime minsiter or chancellor and you agree that in his 15 or so years at the highest positions in British politics, he made no attempts to actually bring change or raise real debate about change, in what way exactly has he been pushing harder than anyone else??

    And whilst change of this sort is an issue for parliament, parliaments are made up of members and it is those members that debate change and Browan has been a member for a long time.

    Your right, she was probably out anyway. However a resignation last week would have just been saving face. A resignation on friday morning would have just been saving face. A resignation on the eve of the European elections is a crisis of leadership and an attack on Brown.

    Taken from the BBC website

    "Communities Secretary Hazel Blears has quit the cabinet, increasing pressure on UK Prime Minister Gordon Brown..................Meanwhile the BBC has seen a proposed letter from one Labour MP calling on Mr Brown to step down. It has not yet been widely circulated but the BBC understands Mr Brown's critics intend to send out some kind of "round robin" letter to MPs, possibly on Friday, to test whether there is an appetite for a challenge to Mr Brown. "
     
  17. holyheadjch

    holyheadjch Valued Member

    UKIP? Pfft, they're a nothing party who are only a couple of notches further left than the BNP.
     
  18. Southpaw535

    Southpaw535 Well-Known Member Moderator Supporter

    Perhaps but they have more policies I agree with and less special people than other parties
     
  19. holyheadjch

    holyheadjch Valued Member

    I think my points support one another nicely. He has been one of the big supporters of change - in fact I believe he was the one who argued for a freeze on ministerial pay a couple of years ago. The fact that he has had no success with implementing change until now is proof that being a senior minister has not aided him in this ambition.
    It requires a majority. There have been several MPs who have actively sought to change the expenses system for years, but because they were in a small minority, nothing has happened. Your logic seems to be [Brown is a member of parliament, parliament has done nothing therefore Brown has done nothing] - this is logically flawed.

    Hazel Blears resigned today because of the news about Jacqui Smith and Alistair Darling yesterday - she is seeking to maximise the impact of her resignation. The reason being that she is angry because he [Brown] has attacked her for being a thieving bitch and this is the most amount of payback she can dish out without costing herself the whip. Before Jacqui Smith was effectively sacked/resigned yesterday, the most damaging time for Blears to resign would have been Friday because it could be directly linked to the election results, which are going to be bad for Labour.
     
  20. BigBoss

    BigBoss This is me, seriously.

    The following is a quote from Nick Robinson (current political editor of the BBC and seasons political commentator). http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/nickrobinson/

    "Deliberate, calculated and with intent. That is the only possible interpretation of Hazel Blears' decision to resign today just before Prime Minister's Questions and on the eve of the last big electoral test ahead of the general election....She has, though, now fired the starting gun on a leadership contest whose outcome is unknowable."

    The evidence is strongle stacked to show that there is a crisis of leadership within labour and that possible leadership contest will take place. And, whilst that is not the sole reason for her resignation, Blears new what she was doing today and did it with the goal of bringing down Brown.
     

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