Personal Weapon: Knife or Collapsible Baton?

I want one of those flashlight thingies...

 

same here, baton due to kempo fighters reason also

 

His mind was put off by the fact he was eating Lechon and drinking a San Mig at the time , so dont worry. It will be back to normal pretty soon and we can all disagree with you if it makes you happy

Best regards

Pat

 

oh don't you worry, PM me when you're here back home. i'll get you one. its in my website too. www.littlebadboy.net

 

cool! thanks bro!

-nico-

 

man, i miss san mig and lechon so bad. oh no! the thread's gonna turn into another drinking thread! lol!

-nico-

 

Get yourself a nice sword stick, one of those walking sticks with a concealed blade.

If i had to choose I'd first go with the baton, extra range and lower legal risks, I'd keep my knife as a secondary.

 

I seem to be gettin; some pretty heavy support on the baton side, any one else? I think all that can be said for the baton's defense has been. And its sufficient enough too I mena. The ofur reasons I gave is a simplified argument. Any Pro-Knife voices wanna get in before this threads lifeline runs out?

 

Pros of knives:

a. Extremely useful tool
b. easy to conceal
c. can be used open and closed (at least a folder can)
d. can be used to get rid of that beard when you have a graduation picture to take (hey, i did it once.)
e. can be used for cooking
f. can be used for eating if one is missing a steak knife
g. can be useful as a prying tool
h. can open canned food (if you don't have a can opener)
i. can stab people (is that a pro or a con?)
j. can slice people (again, same question. is that a pro or a con?)
k. can really hurt people
l. can peel vegetables
m. can peel fruits
n. it's fun to play with
o. like an expandable baton, it can be used as a "pocket stick" when closed

(i can go on and on! a knife is a really useful "tool")

Cons of knives:
a. has a "bad" social stigma attached to it
b. can stab people unintentionally (or intentionally)
c. can slice people unintentionally (or intentionally)
d. can really hurt people
e. it's really scary to people when you play with it (because of the social stigma attached to it.)
f. it doesn't have the same reach an expandable baton has.

anyone care to add to this list?

-nico-

 

Pros of knives:

a. Extremely useful tool
b. easy to conceal
c. can be used open and closed (at least a folder can)
d. can be used to get rid of that beard when you have a graduation picture to take (hey, i did it once.)
e. can be used for cooking
f. can be used for eating if one is missing a steak knife
g. can be useful as a prying tool
h. can open canned food (if you don't have a can opener)
i. can stab people (is that a pro or a con?)
j. can slice people (again, same question. is that a pro or a con?)
k. can really hurt people
l. can peel vegetables
m. can peel fruits
n. it's fun to play with
o. like an expandable baton, it can be used as a "pocket stick" when closed

(i can go on and on! a knife is a really useful "tool")

Cons of knives:
a. has a "bad" social stigma attached to it
b. can stab people unintentionally (or intentionally)
c. can slice people unintentionally (or intentionally)
d. can really hurt people
e. it's really scary to people when you play with it (because of the social stigma attached to it.)
f. it doesn't have the same reach an expandable baton has.

anyone care to add to this list?
*************************************************************

I'd care to simplify it.

Pros
A.)Concealable
B.)Has several non-combatant uses
C.)Can be used as a 'pocket stick'

Cons
A.)Increased Lethality
B.)Lack of range
C.)Legal Issues of Using/and or carrying
D.)Lack of technique applicable
E.)Can possibly harm the user in combat

I think thats an agreeable summary of your list, right?

 

I'd go for the baton because it is easier for people to see (when you bring it out) than a knife so once you "draw" it you'll probably have your opponent crapping themselves and it's less lethal

Also it's one of the three weapons i've recieved (can't think of spelling :bang: ) lessons in the use of

 

Yeah, I'd have to agree that a baton would always be a better weapon when you need to control the damage you deliver to your opponent.

more pros for a knife though:

- easier to manipulate, specially in awkward situations (inside a bus, while seated at the back of a taxicab, etc.)
- faster to deploy (at least a fixed blade would be, compared to a folder or a telescopic baton)


and more cons for a knife:

- sometimes cannot drop an assailant instantly, even with potentially lethal stabs/slashes

 

I can open up a folding knife in a few seconds. At my worst. It does depend on the knife. A swiss army knife would be harder to open quickly, but a spyderco, gerber, etc. folder would be much easier.

 

is increased lethality really a con? take it this way, if you were in a life and death situation, wouldn't you want that increased lethality?

lack of technique applicable? what exactly do you mean by this? any angle of attack you can make with a baton can also be done with a knife.

yes, it can also possibly harm the user, but only if you lose it (or if you're extremely clumsy).


-nico-

 

Well, i know a few knives that can be deployed almost as fast as a fixed blade (think emersons and that wave feature, it deploys as it's going out of your pocket.).

-nico-

 

To me, yes it's a con

Put it this way, in your day to day life up to this point, how many times have you ever been in a situation where the use of lethal force has been a viable option never mind one that you found morally justifiable???
How often do you see your self being in a position like that in the future???

With a blade it's not just a case "possible harm to the user" But also Definite maiming or death to the other guy. I'd rather not put myself in the position of doing that to someone.

 

At any point in which lethal force becomes an actually considerable option, means your weapon makes all the difference. Lethality is not hard to achieve with a baton, but almost impossible to escape with a knife. Its a one-stop drop for a weapon. You can harm your opponent unintentionally at a greater risk then with a baton. With the knife the lethality is at a cliff-prop. Despite the force you use, theres a certain level and only up from there. The Baton just offers overall control around. Mind you, should you ever need lethal force a Baton can easily crack plates in the skull, smash ribs and collarbones into their respective organs. And deliver kneecaping force to the groin and well ...... kneecaps.


Secondly, the angle of attack used in a knife goes double for the baton. Since it becomes angle of attack + level of force. Which means whatever advantage the knife has over the baton, translates over to the baton. And since the baton is ahead of the knife, it makes the idea of increased applicable technique a moot point.


Plain and simple the baton just has a way more control over way more factors that allow it to truly get a step up on the knife. I do accept that a knife may be faster to deploy, but if thats exclusive the brand of either weapon, then its not an acceptable advantage. What if its a flip knife? I have damn trouble with the pocket sized ones. Well maybe its a K-bar knife (God forbid your a navy SEAL) but what if its a plain-old-fashion brack-pipe baton? Thats as quick to employ as a large knife, and half the risk of splattering your reboks with the dinner contents of the mugger. It just seems that the baton is the more realistic weapon.

 

Both Elhig and Kempo_Fighter have good points.

Maiming someone, i have no problem with (If he deserves it). Taking someones life? My life or the other guy's? well, i'd rather it be him than me.

Sorry, but what does "one-stop drop" mean (english isn't my native language)?

Oh, and I still prefer to carry a knife (it's just too useful).

-nico-

 

A one stop drop is one blow that will KO the guy. So he's saying a baton can knockout or incapacitate the attacker in one hit.
Baton vs. Knife
Kill yes yes
Maim yes yes
Range yes no
Close combat yes yes
Damage Control yes no
Quick Deployment depends depends
Multiple uses depends yes

 

One-Stop-Drop weapon is a term that refers to a weapon with limited whatever. Whatever being the variable that you insert to describe as limited.


For example, A knife is a One-Stop-Drop weapon in Damage control.


That demonstrates that the weapon has limited control of the damage it inflicts. Overall, a knife does not provide much choice in just about anything combat related. But I will atest to the many non-combat utility uses it has. Its a usefull Tool. But between the baton & Knife for weapon, I say the baton regins supreme.