old skool lau gar

Discussion in 'Kung Fu' started by quanto, Aug 29, 2008.

  1. SpikeD

    SpikeD At the Frankenstein Place

    Boy or not does not excuse poor performance, There are green and yellow sash grades at the clubs where i train who are younger and perform much better. I don't think he is from Alex's crew. I think the BCKA title on the vid is misleading.
     
  2. Mr. O

    Mr. O Valued Member

    i was looking on the vid, the brown sash doesnt look like the usual bkfa one. however not everyone uses them.

    i have however taught a brown sash from alex barrowmans club before. lets just say she was shocked that we do application.
     
  3. baihoma

    baihoma Valued Member

    I'm surprised to hear you say the student you taught from Alex barrowman's club was shocked that you do application. What is any martial art without application?.
    lau gar is not the only art that has the problem with so called masters bad teachings.
     
  4. xmartialman

    xmartialman New Member

    Thats not unusual way back when I did lau gar we never learnt the applications for the forms but then I was more into the points fighting side than doing forms apart from getting grades you were supposes to seek them out yourself?
     
  5. SpikeD

    SpikeD At the Frankenstein Place

    Application training is something that is part of our regular training and it is usually left for the student to find multiple ways to use or perform a particular move or section of moves.
     
  6. Mr. O

    Mr. O Valued Member

    so i was told it was syllabus for grades and points fighting.

    i dont see the point myself. you may aswell go to a semi contact kickboxing class. end o the day you want to be able to use the lau, and if you spend 30 minutes doing syllabus stuff, then 1.5 hours doing points spparring then you're gonna throw a fast light rev. punch into someones body outside and run round the pavement for 5 minutes shouting "YYYEAAAAARRR" looking for a flippin point. at which point you think, oh no my lau gar didnt work. lol.

    makes me laugh at the black belt grading we're told to try and use lau when sparring and when they say go everyones bouncing round the room backfisting and ridgehanding each other. my oppponent got a bit of a shock when i leg kicked him then stuck a knee in his gut!
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2009
  7. xmartialman

    xmartialman New Member

    Yes thats the thing very few people in Lau gar know how to fight using the forms eveyone turns it round to points or kickboxing not kung fu fighting as it doesnt look good aor spectacular.
    Even the hand and kick blocks very few of these move off the attackers line to gain a advantage its staright back and forward.Thats my take on it like you said eveyone bounces up and down and down expect to be kicked in the bollocks as its against the rules.
     
  8. baihoma

    baihoma Valued Member

    I was very much a points fighter my self, however we were encouraged by master yau to save it for tournaments, in those days we had separate classes geared towards tournament fighting, free fighting classes.
    It seems over the years people are more interested in trophy's and grades, however there comes a time when you cant tournament fight any longer age catches up, that's when application of the art comes into play.
     
  9. SpikeD

    SpikeD At the Frankenstein Place

    As a side point, I attended a Chin Na course yesterday taught by Steve Burton. Thourougly enjoyable pain. :). Anyway, a lot of the basic techniques we were shown were demonstrated as applications from forms and basic blocking. It advocated moving off centre line for some techniques and closing down your opponent in others.:cool:
    A lot of Lau Gar that is taught in the beginning is simply to lay foundation, once the foundation is strong then other 'uses' for what you already know come into there own. Most students though expect to become a film warrior in a couple of years of attending one class a week. When this obviously doesn't happen they either quit or are seduced by the bouncy tournament folk (some of whom are very good martial artists that happen to compete). I do train tourny fighting classes myself but have no intention of competing; it is a good way to up fitness levels and it does you good to get a few kickings now and then.:evil:
    As for sparring using Lau Gar techniques, it is a little bit like when one of your drunk mates learns you practice a marial art and asks you to 'show em what you can do'. It can be difficult to perform what you know without really hurting some one. What i mean by this is that ideally if you had to defend yourself you would take out your opponent as quickly as possible, not trade blows and congratulate each other on good form. A phoenix eye to the throat is a show stopper and it is difficult to spar in that fashion. With lots of practice you can probably achieve this level of sparring without too much damage to you or your partner. Not something to be done every day tho, not good to turn up at work every other day black and blue and no use in a particular hand.
     
  10. Mr. O

    Mr. O Valued Member

    SpikeD Glad you enjoyed Steve classes, Im reasonably local to him so try and get to courses when I can. Not been in a while though too busy with my own club.

    The way I see all of the application is there are some moves which are easily transferable into practical situations instantly. i.e a parry block then a kick in the knee (simple but anyone who has trianed in an MA knows it). Then there are many of the bigger movements from the forms, which become theoretical to a point. Because the movements are that difficult or complicated to apply thwen they get passed off as unpractical. As I have said before though, my thoughts on Lau are that its a simple style made to learn quickly (the length of the forms tells you that, apart from jorn sau and fai loong gee you'll be lucky to get 30 seconds out of them, oh and im not including the degree forms)) look all of the movements in the forms are pretty much smash and grab tactics and its say what you see with them.
     
  11. baihoma

    baihoma Valued Member

    Its like a breath of fresh air, talking to you experts, i mean that in all sincerity, altho i left lau gar a long time ago to pursue my chosen art, its great to hear that there are some serious practitioner's who love there chosen art. i get to understand that lau gar gets a lot of slagging of and as i pointed out i left a long time ago, for the simple reason i took up the art of taekwondo which I've stuck with.
    could someone put me straight on why it gets slagged of so much. why have alot of the old guys left and gone there own way,[ steve faulkner, john Harper, Stan Browne, Clive Parkinson, etc,] i notice that some of those mentioned are now 7th degree black sashes , did they leave immediately after receiving there grade or have they done what alot of masters are doing nowadays and grading themselves?.
     
  12. SpikeD

    SpikeD At the Frankenstein Place

    There technically is not a 7th degree in lau gar although John Russel has been awarded one. As for why Lau Gar gets slagged off i would point you in the direction of this old thread and you will get the drift. http://www.martialartsplanet.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67745. Essentially alot of it boils down to lineage claims and other such stuff. Ultimately it is an old thread that thankfully has been ignored for a while now.
     
  13. SpikeD

    SpikeD At the Frankenstein Place

    Mr. O. I really did enjoy it although my forearms are so sore today i can't hold my pint properly. :) I wish i lived in his neck of the woods as i would definately like to practice chin na regular. It is an eye opener for sure.
    I agree, most techniques within the forms are simple and to the point. it is just a shame that some students are disillusioned by hollywood and expect something more fancy or worse still try to use an entire set in a spar or god forbid an actual encounter. They just miss the point.
     
  14. baihoma

    baihoma Valued Member

    Thanks for putting me straight on what seems to be a very delicate subject.
     
  15. greybelt

    greybelt New Member

    Hi everyone, I just joined this forum after reading these pages.

    This Sunday (18th October) there will be an international tournament (organised by Sean Veira, Sharon Gill, and Andy Cleeves) in Bristol that promises to bring back the high standards of the old skool fighting scene, while improving on the traditionally shambolic organisation associated with it. There will even be a vetarans category where some of the old skool Lau Gar stars of old will be dusting off there pads and competing!

    Sadly I wont be fighting as I'm waiting for my braces to to come off. (back in the day I was a little nipper winning the youth category fights when the oldies were younger than I am now(!)

    http://www.bristolopen.com/2009event.html
     
  16. Jocky Balboa

    Jocky Balboa Valued Member

    Interesting thread, this.

    Chris Boughey is my Chief Instructor and although I know a little about his Lau Gar background, it's only recently that I started to think about crossing over from Kickboxing (well, not crossing over as such, but combining the two).

    I'm aware of some of the "lineage" arguments regarding Master Yau, but from what I can gather, he is very, very good at what he does. Does anyone know if he does seminars across the country?
     
  17. laugarfist

    laugarfist New Member Supporter

    I used to train with Chris as well, ok mainly it was the two Daves, but his lau gar is good. He got up to 4th degree I think and then left the BKFA, don't know why. As far as I can tell Master Yau doesn't seem to do that many seminars. Usually it is Joh Rusell or one of the other Guardians.
     
  18. SpikeD

    SpikeD At the Frankenstein Place

    I think Master Yau did one uk seminar and one in ireland this year and that is it. There MAY be one next year.
     
  19. northernant

    northernant New Member

    Steve Babbs:

    My family have been trying to contact Steve Babbs for many years as my Father used to train and socialise with him back in the late 70's in Hartlepool. There should be an article with him discussing this period and some of his experiences with Steve in the September issue of Martial Arts Illustrated (should be in shops August). Emil Martirossian who is my instructor down in Hove will be the guy holding the interview for the magazine.
     
  20. Tartovski

    Tartovski Valued Member

    What is the point then if you can't apply the forms to a sparring or real world situation?

    Ignored, but not forgotten...
     

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