Not what we needed right now.

Discussion in 'Western Martial Arts' started by Polar Bear, Dec 14, 2007.

  1. Polar Bear

    Polar Bear Moved on

    I don't drink either Bill. Sober as a judge me.
  2. Louie

    Louie STUNT DAD Supporter

    Badges? We don't need no stinkin' badges!

    Hi Bear...
    Their introduction didn't signify the end of JKD, Savate & Escrima, etc., but I know where your coming from - for me grades no longer have that allure they once did because I've been there - done it - and like yourself I happily train under the certified & non-certified.... :confused:

    But I have to ask myself - if I was a young beginner again with no martial art experience - would I commit myself long-term to a martial art where there was no prospect of obtaining a piece of paper proving I had trained with so & so, over a certain period and had attained a certain level of ability - PROBABLY NOT! (shallow... aint I ;) )

    Yes there were gradings & certificates during the height of the fencing school period....

  3. koyo

    koyo Passed away, but always remembered. RIP.

    Thst is one step from drunk as a lord. :D

    regards koyo

    The guy on the right spilled the bear's irn bru.The romans should have stopped when they got to Possil.

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Jan 4, 2008
  4. Stolenbjorn

    Stolenbjorn Valued Member

    You could make up some nifty HWMA-certificates, offering them to norwegian re-enactors at a stiff price :p

    And, yes, Norway have high prices on beer. (the only country in Europe more expensive than Norway is Iceland). So I was more thinking about coming over to you dudes, and if you're thinking about coming over, I'd reccomend you to do the boozing on the ferry, and take the hangover in Norway :cool: But If you're interrested in a holliday in norway, don't hesitate to ask about accomodations, I live on the southern tip of Norway, 3 hours drive from Stavanger, a town with ferry-connections to Newcastle as well :)
  5. Polar Bear

    Polar Bear Moved on

    You'll be more than welcome.

    The Bear.
  6. Louie

    Louie STUNT DAD Supporter

  7. lklawson

    lklawson Valued Member

    The decision to go to a grading/belt-ranking/whatever system is a balance
    between the advantages and disadvantages.

    The biggest advantages of a belt / grading system are:

    1) Allows the instructor (particularly visiting instructors) to instantly
    know the student's minimum capabilities and adjust the instruction accordingly.

    2) Assists the student in tracking his personal advancement and gives him a
    clear understanding of what he must learn or improve to continue advancement

    3) [subset of 2 I suppose] Gives the student a valuable tool in setting and
    meeting personal goals

    4) Is "main stream" and accepted, even EXPECTED by potential students, thus
    raising credibility in the community.

    The biggest DISadvantages of a belt / grading system are:

    1) Exposes the student to vulnerabilities of egotism ("I'm a Black Belt and
    I can kick your butt!").

    2) Generates risk of "next belt" syndrome whereby the student focuses too
    heavily on simply attaining rank and not on true practice and understanding.

    3) Exposes school to the risk of "McDojo" syndrome whereby the school or
    instructor "sells" rankings without imparting true knowledge or whereby the
    school imposes countless fees and testing requirements for insignificant

    If an organization or school is considering implementing a ranking system,
    these are the pros and cons that they typically weigh.

    Say what? The use of a 4 tier ranking system similar to Guild ranking in English Fencing schools goes back to pre-Renaissance. Shakespeare makes a reference to a handbill for the Playing of a Prize (rank test). Terry Brown's book documents this quite well.

    Peace favor your sword,
    Kirk Lawson
  8. RAbid Hamster

    RAbid Hamster Herr Trubelmacher

    personally I prefer the method that we at glasgow duellists use ...

    Not Cleared for Freeplay
    Cleared for freeplay.

    In duelling you dont get to chose your opponents skill level!

    HOWEVER ... The BFHS only recognizes certified Instructor which is the equivalent of having to go straight from no qualification to Dan in a single bound. I would like to see an intermediate level (approved instructor) that would give a little more authority within the society since its like herding cats most of the time. :rolleyes:
    So that would be 2 levels for students and 2 levels for instructors.
  9. Langenschwert

    Langenschwert Molon Labe

    At the AES we do have a ranking system, which is as follows:

    It works pretty well. Each martial rank has a requisite series of techniques that must be done, plus a prize play.

    That being said, having an over-arching organization for WMA isn't such a good idea. It breeds far too much politics and will only serve to slow the growth of HES martially. The reason the reconstruction is going so well is that people are free to do whatever the hell they want without political oversight. That leaves them free to go where the evidence leads them, for good or ill. The cream eventually rises. Considering the growth rate of HES, and the increasing numbers of good fighters being produced, I think the current model of schools having their own internal rankings works well enough.

    Best regards,

  10. piratebrido

    piratebrido internet tough guy

    If I came along how long will it take me to get my black belt?
  11. RAbid Hamster

    RAbid Hamster Herr Trubelmacher

    Buy me a couple of pints and I'll take it off my jeans right there in the pub.
  12. RAbid Hamster

    RAbid Hamster Herr Trubelmacher

    I think protection from govt legislation via a recognized central body is more important right now else we dont have hobby to pursue!
  13. koyo

    koyo Passed away, but always remembered. RIP.

    How about like the Makotokai. One rather dignified chief instructor :Angel: then kohei (seniors) and sempai (juniors) in terms of years training and no great difference placed between them.

    regards koyo
  14. Langenschwert

    Langenschwert Molon Labe

    Good point. The Police State of Mother Britain is keen to keep all Sharp Pointy Things away from Those that might Injure Themselves or Others.

    I guess it's time to start such a WMA-lobbying association for the UK! :) Just start a not-for-profit society (requires a board of directors of three people) and you're good to go. Should take about 3 months, and a little bit of paperwork. Between you, Bear and Koyo you could actually start such an association. Getting other people on board could be difficult, but someone's gotta do it.

    Best regards,

  15. RAbid Hamster

    RAbid Hamster Herr Trubelmacher

    you mean me to shout at them,
    bear to hit them
    and koyo to be reasonable or hit them as required?
    Should work! :D
  16. Louie

    Louie STUNT DAD Supporter

    Yeah you could call it....

    KO-BEAR-RA :rolleyes:

  17. RAbid Hamster

    RAbid Hamster Herr Trubelmacher

    thought that was a character from Thundercats!

  18. Polar Bear

    Polar Bear Moved on

    Funny sounds strangely similar to the duellists except the dignified chief bit. Although George does have the most colourful language to describe the desired effect of techniques.

    The Bear.
  19. RAbid Hamster

    RAbid Hamster Herr Trubelmacher

    I feel I am a dignified and respected instructor (as long as there are no actual students in the salle).

    However further to my exploration of the far end of the language curve, I took the results of tedi-kuma's technique, went home and meditated over it. Studied the subtle interplay of the combatants in my minds eye. Pondered how Liechtenauer, Ringeck and Meyer would have responded till I finally reached a point of understanding.
    My deliberation over, I made a tedi-kuma shaped voodoo doll and have been kicking the cr@p out of it since november!
  20. piratebrido

    piratebrido internet tough guy

    Woahhhh...keep your gradings chief!

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