Not what we needed right now.

Hi Stolenbjorn....
There's been government attempts here to bring the teaching of martial arts into line along with other sports in that you need to be qualified, obtain SVQ's, coaching certificates and go through background checks if your teaching children.
Last time I trained with the Dog Brothers group in Glasgow I learned that the law here in the UK voids the statement that you would "trust each other not to sue each other if either get hurt" - you can still be liable (any Dog B. listening in please update us if you can)

Recently big names in Eastern MA have been looking into WMA - Pat MaCarthy is one - so I think there is growing interest which unfortunately will need some sort of umbrella organisation with certification....
(JKD's early policy of not having grades was admirable but has led to in-fighting, recognised & non-recognised instructors and a variety of break-away groups all claiming to teach the real JKD - Mix a few concepts together read the Tao and hey - JKD :Angel: )

Louie

 

Hm, and I thought that Norway was more controll-freakish than most european countries??? That's what I've grown up to believe, at least. The more I read here, the more it seems that (relatively) conservative England, seems to be like Norway in the 50's, when the state wanted to decide everything, and that Norwegian enjoy far more freedom compared to other Europeans than I have been lead to believe?

That said, I do think that the Norwegian prosecutors allso can decide to procecute someone even if the offended decides not to press charges. But in order for the authorities to do that, they need to be made aware of the incident. Last autumn, I got an axe in my forehead (that explains my avatar ). The dude that hit me was very sorry, of course, and he drove me to a local doctors office. I told them that I had walked in a dark barn, and walked into an iron bar, and the dude hitting me with an axe payed for the stitches. I guess if I'd gone wailing to the police-office, he might have been in some sort of troubble, but the way I know the norwegian police, I guess that I'd be regarded as just as guilty for the incident, as we both were fighting, and I'd only end up spilling bad karma on the Norwegian WMA-community :ban:

 

regarding 'major' injuries in a WMA situation I have been concussed once, I did not regard it as anything other than an accident. The person that concussed me is a friend and fellow WMA duellist ... lets call him Zornhau (thats his blog name). I went home and felt shiity for a couple of days ... end of story

6 months later....

I accidentally ripped up the webbing between Zornhau's thumb and forefinger with a thrust. I took him to accident and emergency. The doctor there after stitching him up (even though she was told it was an accidental fencing injury) gave him a leaflet on how to sue me. Had he not emphasized the fact it was accidental, the doc would have noted it as a stabbing. Ironically while we were in triage, a teenage thug was brought in leaking blood from multiple slashes. In the early 20's female doc mind there was no difference between our accident and the thug getting slashed.

Not only do we have to deal with a govt that wants to control everything .. but we also have a society that is following the USA and becoming extremely litigious!

 

Mitch, dont worry ... the little dears will be insured when I let them loose on each other. Right now they dont get to freeplay. Bear is just champing at the bit to (a) get his sword and (b) be turned loose.
The only person who has been 'hurt' in our salle (for want of a better word) is me thus the 'sausage' and 'kebab' comments earlier (finger injury and an abdomen stabbing) and I am well used to getting battered. 6 months - 2 incidents of bruising .... thats not bad. Heads are well protected with 1600N fencing masks ... the best there is and we have accident and liability insurance. If anyone gets OTT in drills they get a mouthful from me.

ps bear and louie both train with me.

 

TKD Mitch: I see what you mean, and in a way I agree. It's just that in my case, we're so few, and nobody calls themselves Master, trainer or teacher or anything, it's more like a study group, or workshop, if you like. Most of the groups that play around with metal swords in Norway have a club insurance, that they pay with the yearly fee for joining the group; so the more people in the group, the lesser you have to pay pr. person to be insured.

As my group consists of only 4 active, it's probably cheaper to simply insure ourselves. We all (think) we know eachother well enough that we know nobody of us will sue some of the others if they're injured. We all know the risk in what we're doing.

Still, I think finding a club insurance is clever, We get some funding from the state, and we're going to discuss what to spend the money on in January. I think I'm going to suggest that we spend some on club-insurance.

 

I have been following this development with Mr. Sigg's with great interest.
I see that he was "exposed" on E-Budo, a forum known for "outing" the "fakes and phonies in the martial arts world.

On one hand, I can not condone the deception. But on the other hand, there are so many fakes, phonies and liars on e-budo (including very prominent members) it just seems ridiculous that he has to go through all of this.

This has also shown up on the SwordForum, another place filled with prominent phonies claiming high ranks in Japanese Sword Arts, who spend entirely too much time on-line questioning the credentials of others.

I am glad to see that he has the character to just admit it and apologize. This action does show some character, which is a lot more than can be said for so many of the e-budo and swordforum communities.

I applaud Mr Siggs for stepping up to the plate here and wish him the best. He seems to have solid credentials in the WMA world. I hope that people there will not judge him too harshly and afford him the opportunity make things right.

 

It's my understanding that in the uk you cannot sign away your rights, so no matter what you sign you still have the right to take legal action. The only thing waivers are good for is as proof that "they were aware of the risk before hand". This is why insurance is so important.

I've also heard recently that in the uk, you are not allowed to consent to an assault. So in reality, unless you can convince the police that what your doing was a recognisable porting event, you can be done for an injury in sparring.

Please note, I'm not a lawyer and this info is all second hand and may well be wrong. Please do your own research :Angel:

 

So this really happened a guy said he was Menkyo Kaiden of the Daito Ryu. How long ago did he do this? Wow,If he got away for very long, hum.

There are only like three people that have been given the Daito Ryu Menkyo Kaiden!

So Slip, isn't there break of schools of Daito Ryu that are actually recognized by the organization? I could have swore I have heard of people that say they teach Daito Ryu!

 

I don't know Rodger but I believe his qualifacations in a number of other arts are genuine... Here's his 'OLD' bio....

Roger Siggs
Rocky Mountain Swordplay Guild/Tattershall School of Defence
Roger Siggs is the curriculum director of the Rocky Mountain Swordplay Guild and a founding Recotr of the Tattershall School of Defence. Formerly the fencing/martial arts instructor for Glendale Community College, Mr. Siggs has been training in the martial arts for over 25 years, and has been awarded black belts or instructor status in several Eastern martial arts, most notably Tomiki Aikido, Kyokushinkai, and a Menkyo Kaiden license (license of full transmission) for the instruction of Daito-ryu Aiki-Jujutsu.

Mr. Siggs has focused the majority of his research and training to the Western Arts, focusing on the Close Combat dagger and grappling methods, and the Italian fighting arts, as well as the development of the 'Joining Cultures and Methods Way', combining Asian and Western martial arts into an integrated system of self-defense and combative theory. His formal training in the Arte of Defense and Western Martial arts began approximately 11 years ago, and had focused primarily on Italian 16th-17th century Rapier technique. He is a former member of the Society of American Fight Directors, and brings a broad base of teaching experience in the fields of combative application, research and historical interpretation in addition to his martial arts background.

 

From what I hear he is pretty skilled also. I think that makes it worse, the fact is he didn't need the fraud because he actually was a good martial artist. Ah well I dunno, world's a messed up place who knows his reasons.

The Bear.

 

Please do not make a hero out of this man. He did not step forward, he owned up to his lie only because he was caught red handed. Plus, he did a lot of damage to the image of WMA.

 

I think if you read my post, I don't think I was attempting that in the least.
Do you?

The Bear.

 

Ran
it seems like you have an axe to grind here. Virtually everyone who has posted opinions on various forums have taken a somewhat relaxed attitude. Roger Siggs' credentials from the past may be somewhat dodgy, but his WMA ones seem quite robust. Care to explain your position?

 

No axe to grind. Just being honest and taking a realistic view of the matter.

 

Hmmm, just seemed threads on this subject took a rather nasty turn late on the the 20th dec. Given that the previous 8 days had been almost totally conciliatory ... the sudden change in tone of posts on the subject seemed odd.

 

There is nothing odd in the tone of my messages. I'm all for forgiving the man. But I am also total against making a hero out of this man. By his own words, he is a lier. He lied about being a martial arts master and came forward only after getting caught. That is NOT the character of a hero.

 

Again Ran, who on the forum has even suggested that he WAS a hero? Infact everyone here has taken a pretty dim veiw of Roger. So I am unsure why you are taking this line?

The Bear.

 

Hi Ran

I have to agree with Bear and Hamster. I never read the thread as them turning him into a hero but showing their disappointment in the man and his need to create a false martial history. I would also have to agree that I get the feeling there is a reason behind your very strong reaction to his fairy tale history, but that is up to you to reconcile. Personally, I feel he has been an idiot and I think he realises this himself, so doesn't need to be beaten up about it by me or any of the rest of us. There are a lot worse things in the ma world than someone creating a false history for themselves.

Regards

Teddy Bear