MA vs Boxers

Discussion in 'Boxing' started by CirrusFalcon, Feb 4, 2004.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Kaela

    Kaela New Member

    [Wtf R u on about mate? A boxer hits harder than all them crappy martial arts!
    They concentrate on all [naughty language]like flying kick thats are really weak and throw and everything wereas a boxer just punches and perfects that art so ofcourse they hit harder!]

    Ok, let's focus on the point of my post, which was asking for an opinion on the speed difference between a WC punch and a boxer's punch. That's what I'm on about, the speed differences between the two punches. I asked the question because I heard a WC instructor make the claim and I read a book on WC that makes the same claim (i.e. quicker punches). I invite you to visit a local bookstore and read the claims made in WC books.

    You said that all martial arts are "crappy," and that they concentrate on all [naughty language] like flying kicks. Doing so is a _huge_ sweeping generalisation. Have you spent considerable time training in any martial art? Have you encountered a wide number and range of MAs from different martial styles, or only those with "crappy" flying kicks (which, I agree, are highly telegraphic and easy to evade)? If so, please add some substance to your post :)

    Kaela.
     
  2. Andy Murray

    Andy Murray Sadly passed away. Rest In Peace.

     
  3. hedgehogey

    hedgehogey Banned Banned

    Having recently sparred a WCer I can attest to boxing's superior punching (and I am the world's WORST boxer) at least at long range. Maybe it would have gone differently at trapping range, but I bypassed that by shooting a single anyway.
     
  4. Kwan Jang

    Kwan Jang Valued Member

    -You really can't judge a system by sparring with one of it's practitioners. There are far too many variables(ability, experience,ect.). From my own experience, I would agree that most boxers are at least the equal of most WC'ers of similar experience on the outside, though usually in the trapping range, the edge would go to WC.
     
  5. wcrevdonner

    wcrevdonner Valued Member

    Don't get me wrong, Wing Chun people have exactly the same chance as breaking their hands up as boxers do if they don't condition, (and condition well!) I can attest to this by saying that I DID do a wc punch in a SD scenario, I DID break my hand, (and I didn't condition my hands - SURPRISE!) In fact, any style that punches with the lower three knuckles has MORE chance of damaging themselves since the lower three don't have the support of the thumb and are slightly weaker than the top two. (Thankfully I hit him hard enough so he didn't get up, but if I hadn't...thats why I always make the point that if you don't hit the right spot than you lose one of your weapons, etc etc) The point is well made though Andy...
    I'd advocate palm strikes in any sort of self defence scenario. At least then you have more weapons in your arsenal - boxers only punch and so can will only think about punching, (and elbowing for the more experienced!)
    With regards to the first centreline punch not working, thats why you ALWAYS multiple strike. So that if the first doesn't work, the second/third/fourth/etc will; in fact boxers do the same with combinations...

    Back to topic, IMHO, a MA'ist who has good striking ability with hands and legs, (no silly kicks) will beat a boxer of similar standard simply because he has more weapons to use. (And has combinations of them both which boxers will not be used to.) But this theoretical situation never happens, so as usual, it always comes down to the practitioner...
     
  6. Kaela

    Kaela New Member

    Again, thanks to the people who specifically and substantively responded to the question. :)

    As we know, certain arts (none implied btw) make impressive claims and the aim of my first post was to get some opinions on one such claim.

    Dare I ask another question (and risk being misunderstood again), why are people trained to attack with a closed fist when open handed strikes cause less harm to the person striking?
     
  7. LeadLegger

    LeadLegger New Member

    good question. Plus, when you palm strike, you're more likely to strike straight instead of going to the left, kind of like a messed up hook punch. I can't explain it, but a lot of people's right hand punches will strike diagnolly and go left. You don't do that with a palm strike.
     
  8. JurassicWarrior

    JurassicWarrior New Member

    I'm sure boxers train the same. I only said U.S because I do not know how they train in MA in other countries.
     
  9. Pro Killer

    Pro Killer New Member


    No I that a punch works more in a fight and can be used in more situations than a flying kick!

    TKD is a dreadful martial to be fair the dont even allow contact to the face so your not defending the right area.

    Muay Thai and Boxing own combine then u own everybody.
     
  10. Pro Killer

    Pro Killer New Member


    I've done Muay Thai which is loads better than WC, The instructor probably told you that so you would do it his way, EG. If you are a MT fighter and go into a kickboixing gym and do the kick with the shin (The MT way) then the KB instructor aint going 2 let you do it is he? He's going 2 say do it our way it better blah blah blah.
     
  11. Andy Murray

    Andy Murray Sadly passed away. Rest In Peace.

    How much MT have you done?

    How much WC have you done?
     
  12. Freeform

    Freeform Fully operational War-Pig Supporter

    Pro Killer, I've warned you once via PM about your attitude. How about actually backing up your offensive statements with some facts? Your experiences perhaps? Some documented facts? You'll find that your posts will be better receiced if they are less offensive and backed up with facts.

    You say you've 'done' MT which implies the former, so why'd you give it up? Also have you actually praticed any of the styles that you have slated?

    Please fill out your profile, including your DoB so that the members here can tailor their answers to your statements.

    Colin S
     
  13. KenpoDavid

    KenpoDavid Working Title

    Kempo (at least the variation I'm studying) teaches to use the appropriate weapon for the target. So If you are trying to strike to a hard target (like a head) you would use a soft weapon (like a palm heel). For a soft target (floating ribs) use a hard weapon (fist).
     
  14. KungfuDanny

    KungfuDanny New Member

    This is the same as Yin Yang principle I've been taught in Kung fu. Strike a soft(Yin) target with a hard (Yang) strike. Or visa versa.

    Danny
     
  15. Kaela

    Kaela New Member

    Originally Posted by Pro Killer
    [I've done Muay Thai which is loads better than WC, The instructor probably told you that so you would do it his way, EG. If you are a MT fighter and go into a kickboixing gym and do the kick with the shin (The MT way) then the KB instructor aint going 2 let you do it is he? He's going 2 say do it our way it better blah blah blah.]

    Can you give examples of how MT is "loads better" than WC? Or would we be crossing into the cliche "which is the ultimate martial art" question again? :rolleyes:

    If you go into a kickboxing gym and do a kick with the shin then that's probably MT, not kickboxing (unless kickboxing also uses a shin kick?). The instructor may indeed let you do it, but in all likelihood will explain the differences between the styles and ask you to do it the way the particular style that you are learning does it.

    Let's give credit to instructors and assume that they do so to to protect the integrity of their particular style.

    Kaela.
     
  16. Nimrook

    Nimrook New Member

    now the theory on the kicks against a boxer really depends on the skill, and intelligence of the boxer. If a boxer can get the timing right, your going to be off balanced when your up on one leg, he will step and strike. one or perhaps 10 times before you know what is going on. So its not really about the styles but about the fighters. If you have the brains then you've already won the fight
     
  17. semphoon

    semphoon walk idiot, walk.

    Kickboxers also use the shin but not exclusively.
     
  18. Kaela

    Kaela New Member

    Thanks :)

    I don't know much about kickboxing , hence the use of "probably" in my previous post to deflect any attacks ;)

    Kaela
     
  19. C-Fugazi

    C-Fugazi New Member

    As the old saying goes "Its not the dog in the fight but the fight in the dog."

    I've read a lot of the posts on this thread and it seems that there are very few people who have much boxing experience if any at all.
    Boxing and MMA are both very good and each has its own good points and bad points depending on the situation.

    Boxers, if taught properly can usually deliver outstanding head shots and most people when caught with a right hook for example WILL go down regardless of how much MMA experience they have.
    A boxer is taught how to use speed,power and accuracy when punching.They learn how to defend from head shots and body shots and how to counter punches.(not kicks)
    When you recieve a punch to the head it causes your neck to spin in an un-natural movement which in turn temporarily cuts of the oxygen supply to the brain which in turn causes you to pass out, be it 3 seconds or 3 minutes.A well rounded,experienced boxer is capable of throwing a punch that can stun you or at worst knock you out completely.
    A boxer can switch from head shots to body shots (solar plexus) very quickly.Anyone who has been punched in the center of the body (directly below the rib cage) will now exactly how that feels.
    Then you have a punch called 'The Mexican Hook' (upward motion into the liver) which is also a very painfull punch and when hit in a double or triple fashion the results can be awesome for the boxer and very serious for his opponent.Combine a 'Mexican Hook' with illegal kidney punches and your history.

    Although boxing takes many years to master basic combinations can be used and executed correctly within months.
    You may be an outstanding fighter but if you cannot take a punch your going to hit the floor very quickly.The more complex combinations take a lot longer to learn but since these are practiced in many gyms thoughout the country for many years its second nature to use them in a hostile situation with spectacular results.

    Most boxers will throw a hook and follow through with an elbow,some may even hold you behind your head and uppercut several times,others may use body punches and kidney blows to fell an opponent. (All outside of the ring of course)
    There is an awful lot to boxing from dodging punches,parrying or catching them and turning a defensive situation into a offensive one.
    You can train to be a good fighter but in reality you have to be born tough...you cannot learn that in any gym.In other words your either 'ard or your not.

    We boxers learn a lot of tricks that have been handed down by different trainers throughout the years.Some know how to break the bones in your hand by dropping thier head when you punch whilst other can evetually break an opponents wrist by the use of complex parry techniques.
    A boxer will never want to fight on the ground so theres his archilles heal right there.If you try and stand and fight whether its with the use of your legs or fists the results can be devastating for his opponent so its best not to try it.

    I cant say who would win between a MMA vs a Boxer because a lot would depend on the rules and the weights between the two fighters and of course experience and age.
    What I do know is that an experinced boxer can deliver a nine punch combination with ease so unless you have a jaw made out of granite you may have problems.


    Just my two cents of course.
     
  20. Kaela

    Kaela New Member

    [reads C-Fugazi's post]

    [thinks for a minute then reaches for notepad]

    ... be nice to boxers

    [adds arrow]

    ...be extremely nice to boxers.

    [adds to note]

    ...join a boxing gym.

    ;)

    Kaela.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page