The Karate school sounds gash. Exhibit A - brown belt awarded in roughly 2.5 years. Exhibit B - op feels he was awarded grade for time served rather than ability. Exhibit C - sparring sounds like poorly regulated semi-contact:the worst of all worlds Exhibit D - Instructor sounds like a potential douche verdit - leave school?
regarding exhibit A, karate schools usually have three levels of brown belt, with, IME, around 6 months for each, and then at least in my case one year for the right to test for black belt, so if the OP is 3rd kyu, and assuming all tests are passed within those time frames, he would be 2nd kyu at 3 years, 1st at 3 1/2, and shodan at 4 1/2, which is almost the same time i took, so it's not that bad. besides black belt is a subjective standard, ultra fast grading mcdojos aside
Wow... Wasn't expecting so much interest! I posted in here to hear a range of perspectives other than my own, so I really appreciate everyone taking a few minutes to offer their thoughts. I also understand that its difficult for you to comment as you only have one side of the story, but appreciate all the advice. Re using BJJ on him, would dearly love to... nothing would be easier than taking him down (he does not do ground fighting) and tearing him up. But we're not allowed to mix arts - BJJ for the BJJ class, karate for the karate class. Otherwise the sparring is unregulated, and there is no "signal" for pausing a fight. I've never had any worries from any other BB - they give me a hiding, but its all controlled and all in good spirit. This guy is the only one with which this problem exists. So (as I suspected) it may well be a personal grudge (can't quite tell how much he does this to others). So a couple of questions: 1. I've never considered it wise to question in any way any grading decisions by the instructors. But if they seek to grade me again to Brown 2 (next one's in July/August) should I fish for a "are you really sure about that" sort of conversation...? 2. Is progressing through the grades not just about technique, fitness etc; but also the ability to withstand increasing beatings...? I know that sounds like a dumb question, but I'm asking seriously! I really don't want to change schools as the syllabus is good, and my kids are settled in the kids class. So I'm keen to make this work... Any and all thoughts welcome, thanks guys!
1- nope, if you're in it for the long run rank is irrelevant, and it should always be irrelevant if you do it for yourself. 2- no, that is just stupid. some schools might require a certain standard of fighting capacity from certain ranking levels, and some styles more focused on conditioning may require you to do feats of physical strength or resistance on gradings, but beatings are simply moronic, barring perhaps if the physical training is immensely successful and makes students more than capable of resisting before they're allowed to grade. as a last resort, i'd recommend simply taking this black belt guy aside and CALMLY asking him for an explanation as for why he goes ape<poop> on you, and then calmly and logically rebuking his presumably issue-revealing and potentially stupid macho reply. if he does not relent after that, you'll have to either leave, deal with it by "toughening up" (which i would not recommend), or try to brutalize him worse and earlier than he can brutalize you (which is by FAR the least recommendable option, because it can fail in many ways AND it can go very, very wrong if it does).
chuck a karate kid and work hard and earn the respect of your bully. are you the only brown ATM? can you post the sylabus? or what you remember of it? I think it's good that you obey the rules in your Dojo and keep the ground work where it belongs. I simpathise with your situartion but think, you've neve been a black belt before (am i right) he's never done ground work. so he's forcing you out of your comfort zone with his bullying behavior, because he can. If you take him down and easily beat an untrained groundfighter in a ground fight, because you can. are you any better than him? I'd say being 41 you'll have encountered a bully before, you'd know how to deal with him.
Quite right I've never been a BB before, in fact never done any sort of martial art before ( 95% of why I started was to set a positive example for my kids, so they would stick with the kids classes). Taking all the advice on board I think I'll: 1. Treat this as an opportunity to focus solely on my defence for 3 minutes at a time (sparring with all other partners as normal). 2. Feed his ego, and ask him to coach and teach me (as opposed to beating the snot out of me). 3. If that doesn't work I may as well give as good as I get as go down in a blaze of glory! With his behaviour being condoned by the Head Instructor, I think there's nothing else for it. Thanks again everyone for taking the time to comment, wise words from more experience practitioners have helped me think this through.
I think you have a good sequence there. All I'd say is that whereas you do want to concentrate mostly on your defence, you need to attack every now and again, otherwise you'll end up freezing too much and never attacking
I can see both sides. I'm a big believer in nurturing people through the grades. Making sparring, contact and intensity a gradual ramp so that someone unused to fighting and getting hit can safely make there way up the hill. That said there does come a point where you really are on your own. You have make a mental stand that you are a martial artist in charge of their own safety (in and outside the dojo). A mental stand that you won't take any BS. Sometimes that means walking away and sometimes it means matching lick for lick. I don't like people taking the mick with contact but you have to accept that idiots exist and sometimes you may have to match them and that's part of the game. I'll never hit anyone hard. But will up contact with anyone that ups it with me. The instructor can only do and control so much really. Brown belt seems as good a point as any to make that stand so get in there and hammer that dude back. A good tactic to use might be to just keep walking in and landing low leg kicks on the same leg. Make fighting you really boring and painful for him.
Totally into what PA is saying here. no one ever said Kumite was fun, nor easy. just the thrill of contest is fun. make him not like fighting and test his spirit and his will.
Is your sparring supposed to be hard-contact or semi-contact? how much padding? What are the legal target areas? Some people just can't control themselves. He might not even realise how hard he's going most of the time. On the other hand he might just feel protective of his black belt status... Or maybe you're right and he just hates you?
Same with PAsmith's comments - it really depends what sort of sparring we're talking about. Testing will and fighting spirt with leg kicks and grit etc really doesn't have a place in what is essentially a grandious game of tag IMO :dunno: If the sparring is hard contact then I think it's more relevant to do as you both suggested and just get your chin down and soldier through. However, he current course of action, outlined by the OP, is a good one I think.
Indeed. I was merely trying to suggest something he could try if being open and normal didn't quite cut it and get this BB to lay off and stop being a doofus. If being nice doesn't work then try being a dick I say! If this other guy is determined to make sparring non-productive for all involved (by insisting on sparring at a level his partner can't cope with) then I say play his game and blast that leg. Then next week pick an arm and keep punching that.
Thanks guys, and I do like the idea of targeting one area and making it hurt for a few days! Contact is supposed to be light/medium, but he always goes full force. We wear shin guards, gloves and head gear. Sounds OK, but I weigh 155 lbs - so (for example) a full force kick to the ribs can be a touch painful. Plus (due to various physical limitations) I can't kick above waist high. I know all that sounds like whingeing and excuse making; but its certainly not intended to be. I also take people's points that ultimately my safety is my responsibility. I think that if I can't reason with this guy, and I can't get him to back off by feeding his ego, well - I'm going to get beaten up anyway, I may as well give him some back along the way.
HMMMM Fish and I seem to be on the same page today on a few posts. He is right... this is bullying. Crap to all those that are telling you to suck it up. If I remember right your over 40, regardless, when folks are learning.. you teach them if you are the superior fighter, you dont kill them. When I was brown / shodan level I was 30 or so... and had a bunch of 25 year old blackbelts that basiclly used to pound on me for fun. Made them feel good I think. During my Nidan test we used to fight 3 on one during the test and one pounded on the top of my head from behind, short circuted my entire nervous system and my arms dropped. It took me about 5 minutes to get back in the ring, I totally had no feeling in my arms at all. But once I did and Sensei said go... I went straight for him, ignored the other two and in less than 20 seconds sensei stopped the fight. I was so ticked I was going to kill him. Later I overheard sensei say to him, " So have you figured out yet that you dont **** off the old guys?" ... and he proceeded to tell him that if he kept up this nonsense he would let me go at him next time... OF course I got a completly different talking to by sensei, about control of my temper no matter what the other guy had done. ( this happened in 1983) Your sensei needs to deal with this in one way shaper or form.. if not.. you really need to find a new sensei. I will tell you this. ONe time we bounced a dance to raise money to send two students to the world tournament... during that night I found all those hot shot blackbelts hiding when the " poop hit the porthole" and just a few "old guys" out there dealing with the crazy's.... and that night..... " Point was taken" ( After this night not one of the younger black belts ever put a licking on me again... not even close.. they were all very respectful after that) Many of us want to train at a later time in life and true karate will work with this. Age and history bring limitations, old injuries come back to haunt us, and of course one of the most common ones is that we can no longer do those double jump flying double back flip scissor knockem off his horse kicks... but thats OK.. because that is not the essence of karate. The essence of karate is Kata, practice, drills, more practice and as my sensei says ( he is 73 or 74 this year) Practice, practice, practice, and when your all done that practice some more... Doing drills with Sensei is a gamble... cause sometimes he pushes the limits and challenges his Uke.... and down I go... hahahhah but its all in fun and its great.... You know weather its bullying or not.. and remember respect goes both ways.. respect your seniors and instructors AND those who are junior to you.
Osu, Bollocks! A full force unchecked kick to your ribs would break them and KO you for a good bit of time! I have great news for ya ----> He is NOT going full force! Knitting is a great activity too... Osu!
I'm beginning to doubt my initial view because you said a full force kick to the ribs can be a bit painful. To me, a full force kick would, at the bare minimum, cause deep bruising but in all likelihood, they'd break. I don't think he's going full force if that's the case, however, it's clear you're struggling against him quite a bit. I've had my ribs broken, not from sparring mind you but you're not going to be able to spar with broken ribs and you'll definitely feel it. This may be considered a bit of a dirty tactic in sparring, however, our sensei allows us to use it and used it on me in the past. When the person kicks, try to block it with your elbow or knee. Even if you have padding on the foot it will still hurt something fierce, usually for a week maybe more. For example, if he launches a chudan mae geri, use your elbow to block by landing on the top of the foot, or even launching an elbow forward to the toes. If he launches a chudan mawashi geri, quickly move into the quick by either having his foot his your knee or shoving down at the inner thigh above the knee as he'll lose balance (may fall and could also clip you with a punch). Alternatively, if you're allowed, move in and give some hard knees to the inner thigh just above the knee. Another way would be to throw some body kicks, particularly to the kidneys. Like I said, these are kind of dirty moves but according to my sensei, they're allowed even in tournaments and if your partner is injured as a result of the proper block, it's not your fault. He did this on me once, blocked a chudan mae geri with his elbow and it hurt something fierce, then he immediately followed it by kicking me in the gut with a chudan mae geri. For us, although no full contact is allowed, if your partner and you are physically close to each other anytime during sparring, you're allowed to push them away with your hands or feet. Lastly, if grappling is not allowed, could you do just a throw, such as over your hip, knee, shoulder, foot-sweep or even Sutemi waza (sacrifice throw).
