Which would be better to learn if I wanted to effectivelt defend myself? I can do it well enough already, but I always want to get better, and I feel that adding one of these to my arsenal could prove useful.
Hi, As has often been said before, the instructor can be far more important than the style. If you're lucky enough to have the choice between Krav Maga and Systema, then try both classes and find out which suits you better. In what other style are you training? Cheers
Currently? None. But I've trained in Tang Soo Do, Karate, Tai Chi, Kung Fu, Ninjutsu, Judo, Aikido, wrestling and boxing. I have no choice between either really. I'm relying on refernce books and videos. I need to know which is more worth studying.
hey SuperSanity, before saying anything else this is not an endorsement of learning strictly by martial arts videos! having been satisfied with previous martial arts videos (tony blauer and richard ryan stuff) thought id give krav maga benifit of doubt. went for the commando krav maga set offered by moni aizik. some friends and i watched videos several times and tried out some of material. on a controlled level not all out sparring the techniques seemed realistic enough. have seen km videos from other sources and thought they were ok. not on the level of moni aizik though. was invited to watch a couple krav maga classes recently and left with good impression. kind of resembles a blend of western boxing, muay thai and some various striking techniques (eye-gouges, palm strikes, etc.) to me. did some light sparring with person that invited me and thought he was pretty good. as did my kenpo practicing neighbor. now about systema. was really skeptical about the claims made and material shown on thier videos to begin with. early last year was on vacation and met a friend of my cousin nathan that couldnt shut up about how great his systema classes were. finally asked if he would demonstrate some of what he thought was all that. problem was the guy couldnt even get most of the stuff to work on somebody offering minimal or no resistance! we even did some light sparring. hope the dismal failure of systema resulted in his changing schools. have read/heard what others think of systema from having taken classes and or watching videos. never got a favorable impression. spoke to a neighbor that is a police officer and does martial arts (judo and boxing) about systema and his opinion was that someone trying to use systema technique against punches, kicks, etc. would get hurt. someone trying to use systema technique against weapons would get killed! the guys been doing the law enforcement thing for decades and i think his opinions are probably worth listening to. were it still possible for me to spar on regular basis would love to see what else could be gained from krav maga. would rather stay away from systema though. know this was not a well-informed opinion just thought it might be semi-usefull.
hey SuperSanity, if nobody else has said this before please dont rely on books and videos alone. maybe thier ok for reference material. maybe for picking up some ideas or even a few techniques you can work on later with some good instruction. there are probably 1000 posts on this site alone covering the reasons.
A study was done by Black Belt magazine about learning from videos. They showed that if done right (ie regular practice and a partner) it was almost as good as taking classes, if not as good.
hey supersanity, have been reading other posts about systema and kinda suprised that as of yet nobody has complained about my views toward style. until having read those posts never heard anything positive about systema. what i have seen of the style didnt look that great and only negative comments have been made by anyone i asked. about that black belt poll. where to even begin. first a word on instructors. there are some instructors so bad that you might fare better watching a video. in the past i had the misfortune of having a couple of those. yet the possibility does exist the instructor on the video isnt very knowledgeable either. so you end up with poor instruction reguardless. say that you buy videos with a good instructor who really knows what he is doing. and can teach well in a clear easy to understand manner. maybe the material is taught correctly. still you have nobody there to show you the proper and safe way things need to be done. nor to correct mistakes. remember what vince lombardi said. practice does not make perfect. perfect practice makes perfect. if your fundamentals are wrong practice will only result in repeating the same mistakes. again whos there to make sure that youre getting the basics right? about training partners. have been truly blessed where training partners are concerned. have two neighbors that practice martial arts. one does tracy kenpo the other judo with some boxing thrown in. have a couple of friends since high school that practice aikido and shotokan respectivly. add co-worker that does goju-ryu and cousin that does shorin-ryu. mix in a lifelong friend that does s*****n-do and i have lots of training partners. problem is they may or may not (despite mixed backgrounds) really be farmiliar with material on videos. if something really not that different than we have seen before not a big deal. there is some material easy or easier to learn (see tony blauer). yet something entirely different without enough detail might not be that easy for us to use. again videos can give you some ideas. they can be used for reference to something your doing in a class. and you might even learn a few good techniques if they are presented clearly and you already know something fairly similar. they just are not good stand alone training tools. maybe someone else one site could really claify this better. might not hurt to look in search function.
They would say that, they have a vested interest in people buying videos from the adverts in their magazine! Most people who've been training for many years will tell you the complete opposite: training with books or videos is useless when compared with a real school with a decent instructor. It's not even worth comparing the two methods if you ask me.
To be fair, they did say GOOD videos. For isntance, I'm lloking to buy a set by Robert Koga. I use videos and books for a few reasons 1) They're cheaper 2) The only schools I have in this area are Karate (tourist state). I don't feel like walking 70+ miles to find a school. So I take the next best thing. And the Black Belt thing wasn't a poll. It was a study. Thry sent some people to a school, and had some watch videos. And the guy who did the study... not a Black Belt staff member.
If that's the result of the study, then either the students watching the videos were very gifted or the instructors were useless. Either that or they had some strange criteria for their measure of quality... Personally I find it hard enough to get novices to hit each other properly for the first few lessons, and it takes quite a lot of correction of their basic technique by demonstration of their specific problems and allowing them to actually feel what it's meant to be like when done correctly. You can't do this on video with anywhere near the same degree of effectiveness, so the only way people can learn martial arts from a video is if they want to learn dead techniques (i.e. ones that look pretty but haven't actually had any application drilled in with the aesthetics), or if they already have an extremely firm base in martial arts and are looking for inspiration for new stuff to learn.
You won't learn Systema from a video - moslty because it involves practicing with other people rather than standing in fron of your TV copying movements. You can learn some of the drills and exercises and practice with friends, and you can use the DVDs to supplement your class training. But if you are looking to add techniques to your "arsenal" I'd look elsewhere cheers Rob
Repetition, slow motion, and the pause button are wonderful things. Again, I have no schools in my area, and even if I did, I can guarentee a pretty hefty fee. I also don't have time in my daily schedule for classes. So I go with the next best thing.
dont get me wrong for robert koga is a legendary instructor that had a long and distiguished career with the lapd. the video series he produces probably does offer quality instruction. the problem here is that youre talking about learning aikido through video. learning any martial art this way has to be difficult. not an expert in aikido however took a year or so classes. the footwork and movement in general seems pretty complicated to pick up from a video. the greater concern here is safety. the practice of joint locks and throws needs to be done in the presence of an instructor. potential for injury to yourself and/or training partners is all to likely. earlier you mentioned having some background in aikido. why not start thread on aikido forum about learning style from video and see what kind of response you get from long term students and instructors?
I started a thread on Robert Koga, but this is the only recent thread of mine that has received any response. I've practiced joint locks and throws without the presence of an instructor before. But should I need one, I can easily contact a former highschool teacher who is a highranking Aikido instructor.
if you can reach a high ranking aikido instructor then learn from him. theres a difference between practicing without instructor and being capable of calling one for questions. the video alone thing is a bad idead. if not listen to me ask people on aikido forum or start a poll.
I said I could call and ask for advice. If I want full instruction, I have to pay. And the price is a bit too much. 75-80 bucks a month? No thanks.
have to pay $85 a month for my classes. dont necessarily love shelling out that kind of money. (neither does my wife). add the price of fuel these days and martial art classes get expensive. however ive always thought of martial arts as more than a hobby expensive or not. how much is being capable of protecting family or self worth?
Worth more than that. But upon not really having the cash at this moment, I also don't have a car (state of NY and doctors wontt let me drive) I also have NO time to get to class. If I'm working 10pm to 7am, you tell me how I'm supposed to work that out. Especially since I'm COMPLETELY incapable of sleeping during the day. I'd rather know a little (which I do now) than none.
