Knuckles

Discussion in 'Boxing' started by loadsa, Jul 10, 2010.

  1. loadsa

    loadsa Valued Member

    Hi Guys,

    Not too sure if this is in the right forum or not, but I figured the boxers would have more experience.

    I've been doing a self defence striking class for about 4-5 months now, and the problem is I keep cracking the knuckle of my ring finger (right hand). Whilst i'm aware that this is a sort of occupational hazard, I'd like to know if anyone knows of anyway I could speed up the healing process.

    Cheers,

    Dan
     
  2. Kuma

    Kuma Lurking about

    Don't punch with that hand until it gets better and go see a doctor.
     
  3. loadsa

    loadsa Valued Member

    I have seen the doc previously, and was told the same thing...lay off that hand, which I have been doing...I was just wondering if more experienced people had any little tricks / old wives tales that they swear by to either speed up the process, or could give me any tips to stop it happening in the first place.

    But cheers for the advice.
     
  4. Fish Of Doom

    Fish Of Doom Will : Mind : Motion Supporter

    handwraps?

    also, what exactly are you doing that hurts your knuckles?
     
  5. Moi

    Moi Warriors live forever x

    Another for wraps. YouTube or slips's thread somewhere will show you how to wrap
     
  6. loadsa

    loadsa Valued Member

    I haven't tried wraps yet, so thanks for the heads up.

    It's just different strikes, pre-emptive stuff on focus pads, but I must admit it's mainly the hook that gets me, straight rights I'm ok with, and even a left hook is ok. I just assumed that that was because i've a lot more power in my right.
     
  7. Moi

    Moi Warriors live forever x

    Is your fist horizontal or vertical in the hook? Try switching to the other?? Might help
     
  8. loadsa

    loadsa Valued Member

    My fist is vertical when I hook. It sounds strange but, other than when I'm cracking my knuckle, it's much more comfortable that way. But I'll definitely give it more of a go horizontally. Can't hurt...well not anymore anyway, lol.
     
  9. Fish Of Doom

    Fish Of Doom Will : Mind : Motion Supporter

    are you scraping the pads with your fist when you hook? might be the friction screwing up your skin. handwraps should help with that, or alternatively try hooking from closer in (make your hand go THROUGH the pad, if that helps with visualization).
     
  10. loadsa

    loadsa Valued Member

    It's not scraping the skin, that bit's fine, but literally (i think) cracking the knuckle, i.e. swollen up like a melon and black and blue. I'm fairly sure that it isn't because i'm not used to it, because sometimes i'm ok.

    Clearly my technique needs working on, just thought I'd open it up here to get as much advice as i can.
     
  11. Mike Flanagan

    Mike Flanagan Valued Member

    There's really no point in keeping striking with a knuckle that keeps swelling up as a result. You're just aggravating the injury, which is likely getting gradually worse as a result. The key question is: does it just need sufficient rest, or is it a permanent problem that you need to work around.

    I understand why other people have suggested wraps and if you were doing a martial sport then I would wholeheartedly agree. But I'm not sure that's the right approach if you're doing self-defence. What's the point in training a tool that might let you down at that crucial moment when you need it (as a result of all the training you've done it)?

    In my karate class I don't have beginners punching at all. Instead they use an open hand. The palm-heel and the 'slap' can be used to great effect and are - by and large - much less prone to injury when you strike with them. Punches are reserved for people who pass through the first 3 months of training and are on the long-term path.

    Depending on the target, I still use open hand myself. It really depends what part of the anatomy you're striking and from what angle. For some targets open hand is the way to go, for others the punch is best.

    Mike
     
  12. Kokoro-Dave

    Kokoro-Dave Valued Member

    To me it sounds as if you're technique is off. The only times I've ever heard of people intentionally striking with the knuckle of the ring finger is from those who train in Wing Chun or Jeet Kune Do, and even then it's usually only when doing straight, vertical punches. Also, I was always taught to hook with the fist vertical, as a horizontal fist puts your thumb at risk (unless it's a long hook). You should be striking with the knuckles of the index and middle fingers. Also, focus pads are NOT FOR POWER STRIKING! They are only for speed and accuracy. Thai pads, kicking shields and heavy bags are for power.
     
  13. loadsa

    loadsa Valued Member

    Thanks for the advice guys, I will definitely be using open hand strikes for the forseeable future.....and then going over my technique in fine detail with my instructor.

    I wasn't aware that focus pads are not for power, so thanks for that, I'll try with some Thai pads when my knuckle's recovered.

    Once again, thanks guys.

    Dan
     
  14. Kokoro-Dave

    Kokoro-Dave Valued Member

    I forgot to say that if you are going to use a heavy bag, and even the Thai pads or kick shields, you should really be wearing bag gloves, MMA gloves or at the very least hand raps. These pads and especially leather heavy bags have a greater mass and are tougher than the focus pads and so provide greater resistance, so if your technique is off you can damage your wrists, not to mention splitting the skin on your knuckles.

    Good luck and happy training.
     
  15. Master Betty

    Master Betty Banned Banned

    Yeah - and don't listen to people talking about how training with the bare knuckle is better because it conditions you etc. Bottom line is you'll be able to train technique, speed and power far better with gloves and wraps. If you get into a self defense situation then those things are far more likely to get you out of it than a possibilty of a broken knuckle will make you lose it. Youtube's full of videos of ring fighters defending themselves competently and I don't notice how they're at a disadvantage because they don't do knuckle conditioning.

    Still sounds like it's probably a technique thing. Pad holder might just be crap as well. Make sure you let it rest for long enough. If it's a bone injury then you'll need weeks and weeks before you want to start causing trauma to the area again. If you've only been doing it for 4-5 months then you're probably also not giving it long enough to heal if it's happned multiple times in that time period.
     
  16. Mike Flanagan

    Mike Flanagan Valued Member

    I'm afraid I must disagree. I personally know of incidents in which martial artists have damaged their hands by impacting on an opponent and so lost the fight. I can think of one off the top of my head where a dan grade broke his hand on his opponent's face, clutched his hand in pain and got a good kicking as a result.

    Training with bare knuckles isn't about conditioning the hand, its primarily about ensuring correct wrist alignment. Gloves, even wraps, will allow you to get away with things that you can't get away with bare-fisted - there's no getting round that. And that inevitably builds bad habits.

    I'm not suggesting that you just go hell for leather without proper preparation. You need to gradually ramp up your pad training, increasing speed and power as experience grows. Otherwise then yes, you will certainly have injuries.

    Mike
     
  17. Ranzan

    Ranzan Valued Member

    Curious as to why you are not using gloves or wraps?
     
  18. Master Betty

    Master Betty Banned Banned

    so explain that to the mma guys who wear minimal hand wraps in fights.
     
  19. Kuma

    Kuma Lurking about

    They're still wearing hand wraps and gloves, even if the gloves are much lighter than the usual boxing/kickboxing gloves. That's a fair amount of protection. If you see some of their wraps before the fight, they're as well wrapped as any boxer.

    I personally think a good mix is in order. The advantages of training with gloves is not only the added protection which allows you to work longer and harder but also the conditioning effect. Wearing a pair of 8-16oz gloves while training is a world of difference from training with bag gloves or bare knuckle.

    However, I do think some bare knuckle work is in order. It's definitely a different sensation (especially when sparring) and you do need some hand conditioning if you hope to use the same kind of strikes you do in the ring out in a real confrontation.

    A nice mix is putting on a pair of light work gloves or other gloves you might wear on a day to day basis and hitting the bag with those. You'll be surprised how much protection even a light pair of gloves can give you.
     
  20. Master Betty

    Master Betty Banned Banned

    Na I can get the whole tihng about how you may have bad habits from glove training etc that need sorted - it's pretty much impossible to make a proper fist in a set of twins. What I mean is just don't listen to those guys who start alking about calcifying the bones in their hands and deadening nerves etc.
     

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