Kenjutsu in London

Discussion in 'Weapons' started by Nykout, Nov 29, 2015.

  1. Dean Winchester

    Dean Winchester Valued Member

    I swear to god, FMA fits with practically anything.

    Such a great set of systems.
  2. Nykout

    Nykout Valued Member

    Inferior in a way you just described it. I will be on a lookout for fake Bujinkan schools then.

    And about the question of whether 2 years in Bujinkan will make any sense?
  3. Dean Winchester

    Dean Winchester Valued Member

    It's not that they are fake, they are fully licensed and legit dojo.

    They just suck.

    Your last question will depend entirely on your teacher.
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2015
  4. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    What's up with the 2 year limit?

    Have you got 2 years of uni left?
  5. Nykout

    Nykout Valued Member

    First of all, I don't want to abandon my main martial arts for too long. The skill always decays somewhat without training. Second thing is yes, the university system in England. And third thing is, my country's corrupted government plans for completely reverting the bacherlor/master system, thus making it impossible for erasmus program to work. But that's a different story. Let's just assume it's 2 years.

    In that case, I really would like to know. I can train hard and with devotion, and I really would like to study in either one of Koryu schools or Bujinkan Ninjutsu school, but I am just not sure about the point of doing so with the limited amount of time I have. In terms of years, that is, because in terms of amount of training during a week, I can train as much as possible.
  6. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    If you only have 2 years, for a secondary martial art, which isn't your prime concern, then Koryu is not for you.

    Your asking to be allowed to play, for fun, a museum piece.

    Go train bujinkan, you should get to shodan in two years solid practise.
  7. Nykout

    Nykout Valued Member

    Thank you for the advice. I will choose Bujinkan then. I hope someday I will find time to devote myself to Koryu. Thank you all again for all information.

    If I somehow offended Koryu in this thread by something I said, then I am sorry, I mean no disrespect.

    One last thing though: Shodan in two years? In order to get shodan in, for example, Kyokushin, you need at least 7-8 years of training.
  8. ScottUK

    ScottUK More human than human...

    Dead right I would.

    If you want to spar, there are plenty of ways to enjoy yourself without bastardising a ryuha.
  9. Ben Gash CLF

    Ben Gash CLF Valued Member

    Yes, but if your primary interest is sword sparring within 2 years then I'd suggest bujinkan isn't a great choice either. Kendo, HEMA or fma are your best bets.
  10. ap Oweyn

    ap Oweyn Ret. Supporter

    Remind me not to exchange emails with you. Sounds hazardous. :)
  11. ap Oweyn

    ap Oweyn Ret. Supporter


    I'm not really sure where to start with this thread. So maybe I'll just go with random thoughts in no particular order.

    1) If your goal isn't to preserve a tradition for the tradition's sake, what's the importance in learning to fight with a sword? It's NEVER going to happen.
    2) Two years isn't a very long time. I'm pretty confident that, while you might get ranking in a Bujinkan school, you won't have internalized anything especially helpful. If all you're looking to do is check a box (sword fighting: check!), I wouldn't bother.
    3) Koryu isn't my thing. FMA is. (Though, like Dean, I'm retired for medical reasons.) But I feel like you're being pretty cavalier about the opportunity to study with someone who is, purportedly, a major figure in koryu.
    4) No seriously. Who gets into swordfights? Study a sword art because you love it. Don't think you're going to "learn swordfighting" in a couple of years and then go back to capoeira and karate, with the benefit of "knowing sword."

    Sorry if that sounds harsh.
  12. Nykout

    Nykout Valued Member

    1. I wonder why you only perceive two options in that matter, that is either train to preserve a tradition for tradition's sake, or train to get real life scenario fighting skills. You completely omit the fact that people might have other purposes on learning,(for example swordfighting as an example of something with very little to no real life application), like a purpose to deepen their knowledge as well as cultural and martial understanding of a certain period, or maybe to attain bigger spiritual peace.

    2. That is correct, two years is quite a short time on a martial art scale. However, I believe (and not only me) that it's at least a noticeable amount for someone who can train really hard with dedication. My point is not check those "boxes" you mentioned, but to improve myself in various aspects of martial art skills. That includes swordfighting. Still, the main focus during my stay will be Lung Ying, but since they only have 1 class a week, I also want to practice Bujinkan.

    3. If you think that Delaney is "purportedly" a major figure in Koryu, you should do some homework on this. I would also recommend to check the meaning of the word "cavalier" in the dictionary, because from my knowledge it doesn't mean someone who seeks the opportunity to learn with very good and well known instructors, in order to improve one's skill and gain knowledge. Because that is exactly what I aim for.

    4. It's not that I'm going to London with my only purpose being to do a crash course of swordfighting. I wish to get experience in the art of Bujinkan Ninjutsu, and however short my stay there will be, I will learn what I will manage to. After I come back I will already have a base for a lot of HEMA schools in my home area.
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2015
  13. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    1) and 3) If your not training to preserve a tradition, you won't be allowed to study koryu.
    4) why not just study HEMA straight away?
  14. Kogusoku

    Kogusoku 髭また伸びた! Supporter

    *Sigh* I'm getting too old for this.
  15. Dean Winchester

    Dean Winchester Valued Member

    I see all pretence of manners has gone on the part of Nykout.
  16. Kogusoku

    Kogusoku 髭また伸びた! Supporter

  17. Nykout

    Nykout Valued Member

    Ok, honestly I got a bit lost. If there is anything to apologise for, then I am doing it right now. I am sorry, I had no ill will, as well as no intention to show any kind of pretence. If someone could explain to me what exactly was my fault, then please do it, so I see my mistake.

    I may be too immature to understand Koryu, in that case so be it. Maybe I will understand one day.
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2015
  18. ap Oweyn

    ap Oweyn Ret. Supporter

    I'm not omitting that possibility. I get that. I never really anticipated getting into stick fights or machete fights when I began FMA either. But at the same time, I also didn't limit my study on the front end to two years. You used cultural and martial understanding and bigger spiritual peace as examples. Do you think either is really attainable in two years?

    I agree actually. You should develop some noticeable skill in that timeframe. But that's kind of my point. You're not going to contribute to a ryuha in that time. You're not going to achieve spiritual understanding in that time. Or appreciate a culture completely. You will learn some sword moves, potentially. And if that's what you want, follow your bliss. It just seems odd to me to specify such a limited timeframe knowing already that you have an exit strategy.

    Semantic arguments. Ugh. I said "purportedly" so as to make clear that I'm not an expert in koryu myself. I know that Dean, for instance, knows his stuff. And if he says Delaney Sensei is the real deal, he is. But if I don't put in a qualifier like "purportedly," it makes it sound like I have first-hand knowledge of the man. And I don't. Don't get your hackles up.

    Okay. Listen, you can do what you want. At the end of the day, I have no say in it. You were soliciting opinions. I have no knowledge of koryu, but I've been a weapons practitioner and/or instructor for over 25 years. I do know a little about what you're proposing here.
  19. Nykout

    Nykout Valued Member

    First of all, I am sorry for my previous reply being so aggresive. I had a really bad day.

    Yes, you are right, whatever is my reason for practicing the swordfighting, then 2 years is not enough. I will have to rethink my plans, thank you.

    I've been spread between those 2 threads that I made; this one and "Bujinkan in London". I thought I admitted on both that I no longer see studying Koryu as an option (because of my limited timeframe as well as currently not being able to contribute to Koryu), but it seems like I only said it in the Bujinkan thread. Sorry, that was the source of misunderstanding that I still wish to study Koryu. I said in the other thread that it surely is not an option right now.

    I am sorry again, english is not my main language and I messed up the meaning. I thought that by saying "purportedly" you actually doubted the fact and used it as a way of mockery. My bad, sorry.

    I know, I shouldn't have reacted this way. Thank you for all the advice and help with my question. Maybe I should indeed settle on HEMA or FMA.
  20. ap Oweyn

    ap Oweyn Ret. Supporter

    Don't worry. I wasn't being my most diplomatic either. No harm, no foul, right?

    I wouldn't discourage you from doing sword fighting. Just from putting a hard stop on it from the beginning. You know?

    No worries.

    No need to apologize. The way you interpreted it is probably the more common way to interpret it anyway. I should have been clearer.

    Either are solid options. I have far less experience in HEMA. But what FMA would do for you is mesh very readily with the capoeira and karate you're doing now. I've long thought that the footwork in capoeira and FMA complement each other very nicely. And you'll find many, many FMA folks with previous backgrounds in karate (myself included).

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