kata

Discussion in 'Ninjutsu' started by swat, Apr 18, 2003.

  1. swat

    swat New Member

    could anyone help me with an useful website? i'm looking for ninjutsu kata lessons in pictures or even mpegs.
    does anyone know one?
     
  2. SilentNightfall

    SilentNightfall Eien no Ninja

    Afraid that you won't really find much of anything on the web as far as instruction on the kata from any authentic ninjutsu schools, at least not from any of the x-kans (but then, what else is there?). The main reason for this is probably that no one would waste their time putting something like that together on a website when they no that without proper instruction, it is impossible to get the proper feeling from the kata. There are actual videos for purchase that you could look into, but I would say that they are best used as refreshers and not learning tools. At least not for the kata. Hope this helps.
     
  3. Brad Ellin

    Brad Ellin Baba

  4. SilentNightfall

    SilentNightfall Eien no Ninja

    Ahh... Here I thought he was talking about the actual kata. Swat, were you speaking of things like the Sanshin and Kihon Happo, or were you looking for videos online as far as the real, ryu-specific kata? If you were just looking for the Sanshin No Kata and the Kihon Happo, you can find videos of those all over the web. My first reply was in relation to trying to find the actual ryu-specific kata. My apologies if you were not referring to these.
     
  5. Brad Ellin

    Brad Ellin Baba

    If Swat is looking for videos, instruction type, I understand Jack Hoban has put out a pretty good video. I see it up on eBay all the time. Since Swat just asked for katas, I thought the link above would be useful. Just keep in mind, you really need someone who teaches to help put things together. Doing the Sanshin and Kihon Happo involves more than just aping someone else's movements.
     
  6. SilentNightfall

    SilentNightfall Eien no Ninja

    Yes, I also heard good things about Jack's videos. I also know that Richard Van Donk produces some very nice videos, but his one's that contain the kata and such from the various ryu are apparently part of his courses for 2nd, 3rd, and 4th Dan. Unfortunately, such courses are well over $100 each from the prices listed on his website. His blackbelt home study course tapes are very reasonable, however, if you are looking for ninjutsu techniques to learn (or as a refresher to class work, as most videos should be used for). They do not, however, contain any of the ryu-specific kata outside of the Sanshin and Kihon Happo unless such were omitted from the descriptions given of each tape. If you want to learn the ryu-specific kata, why not just buy some of Hatsumi-sensei's tapes, eh? Probably your best bet there, Swat.
     
  7. Brad Ellin

    Brad Ellin Baba

    True, so true. But Soke's videos are quite expensive. I do know of one place here in MD where I can get them for $80 apiece. But, that's out of my budget range, I might be lucky to get one a year.
     
  8. Darzeka

    Darzeka New Member

    Just curious what the kata's pertain to.

    The closest things to kata that I've seen are timed throws (very messy list of throws done by one thrower with two attackers), punchbag series (two bags representing two or more opponents and a series of stances and strikes to do. No set movements - you just make it up), Part n (same as punchbags with more opponents and obstacles), part 5 (Part n with no obstacles but two live opponents to add to the bags), Weapons hommes (I don't think thats how you spell it, but a set series of strikes with a weapon, the higher up the faster and more "lets kill a small army" attitude) and weapons Kumites (two person hommes, looks very cool).

    Was just wondering what the emphasis in the katas were - memorising a specific set of movements, etc. or is it all free flowing and dynamic?
     
  9. Brad Ellin

    Brad Ellin Baba

    Depends on who you ask. My take, and this is from 20 years of study, is the "katas", the Sanshin and Kihon Happo, are a set way of performing the basic body movements. The intention is to teach you how to move your body properly, and therefore give you the freedom to move when and where it's needed. Once you have begun to understand them, you can discard the notion of a set way of doing things and begin to move more freely. So, it does start off as memorizing a specific set of movements and as you progress it becomes more free flowing and dynamic. Any help?
     
  10. SilentNightfall

    SilentNightfall Eien no Ninja

    I agree with Kurohana. The most prominent, and perhaps vital, of all the kata are said to be the Sanshin No Kata and the Kihon Happo. They are said to form the basics of our art. There are, however, set kata for each of the ryu that comprise the Bujinkan system. I have only been exposed to a handful, literally. There are things hidden within the kata that teach principles and certain feelings. Once kata are mastered, you are supposed to forget them and just be formless. This is the ultimate goal, I believe. Hatsumi-sensei often talks about losing the forms. Once you learn all you can from them, you forget them. Sounds odd, but I can perceive the lesson in that. Of course, I'm ways off from even learning all the kata so I can't really offer much on that. I'll stick to my normal training until I'm ready to study kata, or until it comes up as a lesson in class. Just know that the kata do exist beyond just the Sanshin and Kihon Happo. They all have lessons and principles as do the Sanshin and such, but as far as learning them correctly from a source other than a qualified instructor? Good luck there, my friend.
     
  11. SilentNightfall

    SilentNightfall Eien no Ninja

    Oh, and in case it isn't obvious in the above post, we ae talking about kata as set movements here, though there is some discretion in that. For instance, one kata from Koto Ryu we were working on in class when Papa-san was away and Jim Foley was teaching our class had us throw a kick at one point, but our distance and the overall feeling at the point of the kick determined if we planted the kick as a sort of "step" if you will, or if we reset the foot to its original position before the kick was thrown. That is what is meant by gaining a feeling from the kata. So I guess some of the kata are set in a way, but have many different variations (henka). Just a thought from an individual with limited knowledge and experience with the kata of our art.
     
  12. swat

    swat New Member

    i'm from eastern europe.
    thanks for the help. i'll check this site out.
    i have practised shotokan, now i just took my second ninjutsu (genbukan) training.
    ooof i was a bit confused, all is different here. I wanted to follow step by step the kata movements looking to some pictures or movies. for shotokan katas the net is full.
    tx again
     
  13. SilentNightfall

    SilentNightfall Eien no Ninja

    Well, I assume that the Genbukan do the Sanshin and the Kihon Happo the same way that we do. I couldn't tell you for sure as I have never trained with anyone from the other organizations. You can find other sites if you simply try searching the net for Sanshin No Kata movies. Try seperating the phrase "Sanshin No Kata" and the word "movies" with a comma. That way, any ninjutsu site that has movies for download should still come up. If you can't find anything else, just ask and I'll try looking myself. And I apologize for not responding until now to your last post.
     

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