What do you guys think about; Isometric + Dynamic Tension + Moderate Reps. (8-12) Ex. Training on the Gripper; You keep the tension all the time and holding it for a few seconds with 8-12 Reps. or Without isometric, Only high reps and Dynamic Tension. Which one would you choose?
Use the grippers like you would any other weight. High weight, low reps. I don't see any reason to do otherwise.
i'm just trying to get my head around this.... Isometric - muslces under tension with little or no movement where the muscle does not shorten or lengthen while under tension, now if i'm right dynamic tension means there is movement under tension so how can you put the two together?
Dynamic Tension; I mean that you should flex your muscles through the whole movement and then comes the isometric part, when you stop and squeeze it for a few seconds. I am only using a rule of Dynamic Tension; Flexing the Muscle through the whole range of motion. "Isometric - muscles under tension with little or no movement." Little or no movement, I am using little movement. The difference with my idea is that you should flex your muscle through the whole range of motion not like isometric when you have holden it for a while then you release the tension, I prefer to keep the tension through the whole range of motion.
And you do that? "Use the grippers like you would any other weight. High weight, low reps." I mean would you do the same amount of reps on a Biceps Curl and a Forearm Exercises (Ex. Reverse Curl.) I do more reps. and sets for the forearm (type I muscle fibers.) compared to the biceps. By the way I don't use High weight, low reps cause I learned that you burn down your muscles while running and instead I do the bodybuilding range (8-12 reps.) The power/strength you get from weight lifting (1-5 reps) you can achieve it by other type of training.
but isnt that the idea of any muscle building exercise wheter its plyometrics, iso or whatever? the muscle is under tension throughout the rep...
why not? explain.... please explain a bodybuilding range? do you mean hypertrophy? also in comparison you would need to be running a fair few miles each day for it to cut into muscle work explain please...
Yep - when I can do 5 or more reps on the CoC I'm on, I move to the next one. I don't do bucep curls, or reverse curls. Um. Ok. You got a source for that? I'm not sure that the idea that your forearm has a different type of muscle fiber from your bicep is true. First off, you don't burn down your muscles while running. You use calories that could otherwise be used to build mass. Second, it doesn't follow that you should use high weight and low reps because you burn your muscles down when running. Third, calling 8-12 reps the "bodybuilding range" isn't entirely accurate. Most bodybuilders use high weight low reps to bulk up. How does using 8-12 reps factor in to all this anyway? Show evidence. I hate to tell you, but the foremost strength coaches in the world disagree with you. The strongest dudes in the world disagree with you. I disagree with you.
As a PT i'm tending to disagree as well, looking through all of his posts he seems to be spouting a fair amount of uneducated guesses.
From a biological perspective, all of the muscle in your upper body has a larger proportion of white to red muscle fibers.
1-5 rep range; myofibrillar hypertrophy (muscles also increase in size due to a small amount of hyperplasia but this contribution is minimal). 8-12 rep range; sarcplasmic hypetrophy (Sarcoplasmic hypertrophy is characteristic of the muscles of bodybuilders while myofibrillar hypertrophy is characteristic of weightlifters.) Well you burn down your muscles if you exercises for 6-12 hours/day and you follow a low body fat diet. "Um. Ok. You got a source for that? I'm not sure that the idea that your forearm has a different type of muscle fiber from your bicep is true." I've read it from a book and website. How I know it's true? The forearms has a faster recovery time (1-3 days) and becaue it's used many times daily it will become or it's already type I cause you need that endurance to keep doing the same movement for a while. "You use calories that could otherwise be used to build mass." You don't use calories to buil up your mass, calories (most from fat) will make you fat and just because you have a high amount of calories stored in your body your body will use it as a fuel instead of burning down your muscles for energy/fuel. "First off, you don't burn down your muscles while running." Have you seen runners that doesn't weight lit, tell me? are they skinny or big. They are skinny cause the burn down there muscles and because of you run a lot your body will need more energy/fuel compared to body building and to get that energy you body will use your muscles as energy instead of fat cause fat is very slow to use as energy. Want proof? http://www.discoverychannel.co.uk/humanbody/strength/video3.shtml
True, the muscle is under tension throughout the rep but I am talking about "Extra Tension" (Dynamic Tension). Compare a Normal Push-Ups and a Push-Up with Dynamic Tension, which one is the hardest? Isometric the muscles flexed for a long time but it the tension is still the same as a normal exercises normal and because of that it doesn't have the "extra tension". More tension than a normal exercises will recruit more muscles (and fibers) to work and your strength will increases. Try this two exercises with Dynamic Tension; One-Hand Push-Ups 5 reps. Squat Pistaol 5 reps. Keep the tension, it will become much harder but it's more effective. Slow Movements with bodyweight exercises, If the BW Exercise is easy. Weight Heavy - try to do it as fast as possible. Weight Light - Think that is a heavy weight and you can't lift fast.
"why not? explain...." K let me ask you a question, after you done let's say 8 reps of Biceps Curl would you then do 8 reps of squat? ------ "please explain a bodybuilding range? do you mean hypertrophy? also in comparison you would need to be running a fair few miles each day for it to cut into muscle work" Bodybuilders aim is to get huge and the most use the 8-12 rep range which is sarcoplasic hypetrphy. I mean why would you use the myofibrall rep range (1-5) when it has been proven that it doesn't increase as much size as sarcoplamic hypertrophy, it's more focused to increase strength. Search in wikipedia "Muscle Hypertrophy" and you understand. By the way doesn't martial artist run a lot? ----- "explain please..." Isometric builds raw strength and plyometrics for power, etc.. Let's say you follow a low fat diet and you will burn down your muscles, to make your muscles bigger you have to weight lift (8-12 rep range) so you replaced the muscles you burned down and also gotten extra. You'll be a slow gainer but it's very effective for martial art.
Whether or not your muscles increase in size is dependent on whether or not you have surplus calories in your diet. It doesn't matter what rep range you are in. If you don't eat more than you burn, you aren't putting on weight. Period. For the rest of it, yeah I can agree with you. However, if you aren't using steroids, I think the best way to get big and strong is in the 1-5 rep range. It has nothing to do with fat content in your diet. If you exercise for 6-12 hours a day (which is ridiculous, no clean athlete trains for 6-12 hours a day), and you aren't consuming enough calories, your body is going to cannibalize itself. The type of muscle fibers in a certain area does not dictate what rep range you should use in that area. For example, your legs are almost entirely composed of type 1 muscle fibers. Does that mean you should stay away from 1-5 rep squats and deads? No. Does that mean your recovery time will be better than a 1-5 rep bench press (which largely utilizes type 2 fibers)? No. Not really. If you have excess amino acids, you will undergo hypertrophy, and much of the excess calories will be added as muscle. Additionally, it doesn't matter if the calories come from fat, protein or carbs, if you consume more than you use, you'll put on weight. They are skinny because aerobic exercise doesn't produce hypertrophy, and because they use more calories than they take in. The only time your body cannibalizes energy is after it has used up available glycogen stores and switches to cannibalizing adipose and muscular tissue. Bro, just so ya know, discovery channel isn't proof (even though that was a good video), but that isn't exactly relevant. You are talking about people who are running 12+ miles or swimming the english channel. Runners carb up before events like that anyways. It just isn't applicable unless you are doing an endurance event.
Just because it's harder doesn't mean it's more effective. Find me one high level athlete or bodybuilder who still publicly advocates dynamic tension, and I'll find you one is stronger and performs better by following more advanced, better training methods. Why? Just do the pistols, and the one hand pushups. I won't even bother. I'm gonna hit the weights. Just because it's harder, doesn't make it more effective. You don't really want What? First off, I don't do curls. I would do the squats first. What's your point? Isometrics build strength at a specific joint angle, which tapers off at other angles, and it doesn't build as much strength as maximal strength training. What? Ahhhhhh . . . now we get to the crux of the issue! You state that training in the sarcoplasmic range to put on weight, and not build strength is very effective for Martial Arts. Would you compare fighting and Martial Arts to: A. Posing in bikini bottoms. B. Playing a game of American football. C. Participating in a wrestling match. D. Running a Marathon. E. Participating in a boxing match. Rank them in order, with 1 being most like fighting and 4 being least like fighting.
"Just because it's harder doesn't mean it's more effective." It challanges your body, this will make improvments. You should read this book about why Dynamic Tension is best for martial artist; "Tsatsouline Pavel power to the People" "Isometrics build strength at a specific joint angle, which tapers off at other angles, and it doesn't build as much strength as maximal strength training." True but it's build raw strength, Do you know Bruce Lee? He did isometric to build up his strength (read "The art of Expressing the Human Body".) " You state that training in the sarcoplasmic range to put on weight, and not build strength is very effective for Martial Arts." No it's not effective for martial artist but It will build up the burned down muscle, problem It doesn't provide as much strength as the myofibrall hypertrophy. Any type of training build up strength but how much strength is the difference. Being a slow gainer and training 6-12 hours is effective! (Ask an shaolin munk how much they exercises each day.) "First off, I don't do curls. I would do the squats first. What's your point?" Everyone knows that the lower body needs more reps, calv muscle; 12-20 reps with high weight. Why? you use the calv muscles daily and they support your whole entire body. Arms, isn't used as much as the lower body there is the difference. Forearms, Neck, Abs and calv muscles is high reps muscle and they have a faster recovery time. (Search www.bodybuilding.com, or other website.) 5. Posing in bikini bottoms. 4. Playing a game of American football. 2. Participating in a wrestling match. 3. Running a Marathon. 1. Participating in a boxing match. More advanced doesn't mean that it's better.
Yeah, he also says: So what's your point? I never said isometrics were useless. "Raw strength" doesn't really mean anything. Isometrics build strength at a specific joint angle, and the more you get away from that specific joint angle, the less strength it builds. I'm not saying isometrics are bad, just that you shouldn't replace heavy lifting with isometrics, or even light weights with added isometrics (which is pointless). Um, if you are training and eating right, you won't burn down your muscle. Thus, there isn't any point in trying to lift like that unless you are trying to put on weight. A. The best strength trainers, strongest guys in the world, and I disagree with you. Instead, you should be lifting heavy for an hour each exercise, and getting plenty of rest and good nutrition between workouts. B. Because Shaolin Monks aren't top athletes, lifters, or trainers, I really don't care how much they exercise. I'm not going to model my training after people who aren't the top experts in their field, or have results similar to those I'm trying to achieve: strength, excellent lactic threshold and anaerobic capacity. No, not everyone knows that. In fact, anyone who knows what they are doing disagrees with you, because it's incorrect. Any reps beyond 12 are a waste of time if you are trying to build strength. Prove it. I'm not telling you you are wrong to put you down or make myself look good. My sole purpose on this forum is to educate people about exercise and nutrition methods and science. I'm trying to help educate you. I would, at this point recommend that you check out the MAP resources section because there is a bunch of solid stuff in there that you need to learn.
