you know what I find amusing? This thread is mostly a series of posts based on misunderstandings of misread posts and a compounding effect of unwilling to open the mind and listen or to even read what someone said before commenting.
Go try "rubbing" your hands together until they heated up a little bit and smell them. Do you notice any difference doing that before and after practicing chi-qong ??? Is that related to Chi ???
Is there a specific type of attacker or situations that Tai Chi (especially Yang style) works best or better against? Is it truly that adaptable that it rests with the practioner to define its limits as a self-defence / combatve art? I have a few questions as I'm considering Tai Chi as an art I'd like to learn, here are my main questions... a.) In Ninjutsu at least the Taijutsu part of it, you learn to utilize the whole body in movement, both in attacking and recieving (defending), does Tai Chi as a martial art teach me to move in such ways? In short, is there any tumbling, recovery from falls training, moving with an attacker? b.) As far as ranges of attack and defence, for Tai Chi, what are they? (for example) Long to medium on attack and short to medium range on defence? In short, could I use this art in a crowded alley, a restaurant bathroom, an aisle in a airplane? c.) How does Tai Chi as a defence deal with a Brock Lessnar type of attacker? A large, aggresive, experianced, tolerant of pain sort of brute, a tank in other words? And does it take more than four years to get this good at it? d.) What is in my aresenal of attacks and defences? Not the whole list as that would likely be too damn long but in short, are knees, elbows, head butts, foot sweeps, hand strikes (knife edge or open palm strikes?) etc... utilized in this martial art? I hope my questions are not seen as challenges but merely questions from someone who is earnestly seeking true information. I thank all who answer ahead of time, thank you...
Hi Ghostrider, I practice Wudang Tai Chi based on Wu style. It is a highly practical style and a student can take the art as far as they want to in terms of practising just for health or taking the art to weapon forms and the martial side which cannot and should not be a seperate part of the art. In answer to your questions. a.) In Ninjutsu at least the Taijutsu part of it, you learn to utilize the whole body in movement, both in attacking and recieving (defending), does Tai Chi as a martial art teach me to move in such ways? In short, is there any tumbling, recovery from falls training, moving with an attacker? The whole body should move as one unit and this is one of the main principles of Tai Chi.One should move with the attacker and blend with their move and ultimately lead them into 'The Void'. Some schools may practise break falls as part of the art but these are not usually included in the tai chi syllabus. b.) As far as ranges of attack and defence, for Tai Chi, what are they? (for example) Long to medium on attack and short to medium range on defence? In short, could I use this art in a crowded alley, a restaurant bathroom, an aisle in a airplane? Tai Chi in general is used as a short range art and the techniques could be used in a tight space if required. One must bear in mind that the 'Form' was born from the techniques and not the other way around and that the main thing to execute in the art is the principles of yin and yang-This applies very much to the function of the applications otherwise we would end up with an art that resembled an external art. c.) How does Tai Chi as a defence deal with a Brock Lessnar type of attacker? A large, aggresive, experianced, tolerant of pain sort of brute, a tank in other words? And does it take more than four years to get this good at it? Good question! It really depends on the size and build of the person using the art. If you have a 'Tank' of a person executing the techniques then they will probably do pretty well against another 'Tank'. I'm a pretty small guy and do not weigh a lot and therefore I need to train with bigger partners to get a feel for fighting the larger person. Force against force does not work and is against Tai Chi principles. I would have to re-think and apply a different mind set to dealing with a bigger attacker and often we do not get much time to think about this if an attacker is suddenly on you. However if the target presents itself I would personally punch/strike/Kick to the groin,neck and eyes to gain an advantage. Or pick something up and hit them with the object-This is where training in weapon forms comes into its own. My moves would have to have power and speed and if possible I would employ the evasive footwork trained in the style that I practise. A well known maxim in tai chi is 'repelling a 1000 pounds with 4 ounces' which is easy to say and bloody difficult to do! d.) What is in my aresenal of attacks and defences? Not the whole list as that would likely be too damn long but in short, are knees, elbows, head butts, foot sweeps, hand strikes (knife edge or open palm strikes?) etc... utilized in this martial art? They are all utilised in the art. If they are not used in the particular style that you may end up practising then add them in! But remember anything that you add to your arsenal make sure that you use the tai chi principles when applying them. The answers are not exhaustive and much more could be added but I ain't writing a book! You may have trouble finding a teacher who has the ability to pass on the complete art to you and you really must ask yourself why you want to change/augment your current art and change to Tai Chi Chuan. Please email again if any queries on the above, Regards, Wutan/Mark.
That was very, VERY informative. Thanks!!! You are a true e-angel :Angel: . Now, done with the compliments on with the comments... As far as my size, I'm no Brock Lessnar myself, but I'm inbetween as I am a hair over six feet and somewhat heavy set as I used to be quite athletic. But I asked that question not as ploy of any kind but merely because I actually face those opponents usually. I don't know what to say about it, it's weird, but that's the way it goes. And I asked the question about ranges since a determined attacker is not going to attack you where it's conveniant for you, it'll be usually a time of their choosing. So that's why I used the bathroom stall, the airplane isle, and the crowded alley as an example. But you answered all my questions brilliantly and I again thank you. One of the reasons I look to Tai Chi is that it is one of those arts that can change and adapt with you as you go on in life. It is so full of challenges and new skills and relearning to reuse old skills in new ways type-of-art that it seems I could only get better and more refined within the art, a highly attractive prospect. As well Tai Chi has so many intrinsic and external health benifits that it's almost (in my eyes) like the Multi-Vitamin of martial arts. Now the only problem (if I choose Tai Chi) is to find a good teacher. Not always easy, even in more widespread arts. I guess the only thing going against Tai Chi in the competition against Aikido and Ninjutsu (which are the other arts I'm considering) as a good, life-long martial art is that it isn't always easy or conveniant to find a good Tai Chi instructor that teaches martial as well as the health benifits with the art. But that remains to be proven wrong and so I still search. Again, a very thorough response, thanks.
Yes, as Wutan said, one of the most important principles of taiji is to move with the attacker, to flow with/around their attack. But taiji is a standing art, and there are little or no traditional tumbling or ground fighting methods taught in standard forms. taiji is a responsive art. it was designed for close quarters fighting. basically, most strikes are made at a small distance to gain maximum power. One of the sayings of taiji is "if the opponent doesn't move, I don't move. If the opponent attacks, I strike first". There are many quick stepping/attacking methods taught that allows you to close a distance very quickly and get to taiji fighting range, which is the range of a "real" fight (i.e. up close and personal, not competition distance) Taiji never uses "force against force", so it is effective against a stronger opponent. Also, most taiji attacks start or end with strikes to the face and (especially) neck, which is vulnerable no matter how large you are. yes, all of the above. but usually you will attack with more than one part of your body at once (e.g. foot sweep and elbow, etc.) to make the most of the attack.
Man, this is great input, seriously... it's making my decision both tougher and easier at the same time...ouch! Tai Chi sounds like a great art to take, one that can ride with me till they spread my ashes on Mars, that's very cool. Just so everyone doesn't get the wrong impression, I'm not violent, nor do I look for fights, I try to be aware of my environment (I've worked in a Super Max Prison before and as a doorman in College). I'm mindful of what I say and the body languages given off by those around me and my impression (intended or not) on others most of the time. I'm not perfect in those areas but I try. It's just that I end up in either totally great situations with people, or real crappy ones, maybe it's my cologne... Either way, it's led to some vicious fights on my part and that's why asked about the close quarters fighting and handling a tank of a man. Thanks for the input, I'll sort through all this and let you know when the time comes of what art (out of Aikido, Ninjutsu and Tai Chi) I've choosen. Maybe I should just try all three out for a few months when I get back to training and then make the decision. Again, thanks for the help.
Now some place they tell you they teach Yang Taiji, but then all they teach you is the 24 or 48 or even the 104 yang Taiji form, then you are learning the contemparory new young taiji which is created specifically for exercising only I am a firm believer that all traditional Taiji are martial arts! but now a days the slow element has been emphasized so much that especially for those who are practising yang taiji, does the forms only, and practising the slowness only. But in fact in Taiji training, one should do the forms to practice your concentration, and your body co-ordination, but also very important is to practice "fa jin", (normally done with a thick bomboo pole), and push hands.
GhostRider, I don't know if you'll havethe opportunity to take more than one style, but you might consider it. I study Ninjutsu and Tai Chi Chuan, and I find the two go very well together.
Does the Yang family Grandson Yang Jun teach fighting taiji or does he only teach the exercise form? I got kicked off the Yang family board for asking if he teaches exercise only, because all the other teachers I've met from China itself who have immigrated recently and grew up post-revolution don't teach fighting. So I really want to know, does this guy Yang Jun teach fighting? Because someone that I know who has been there for 8+ months hasn't seen any or heard of any.
Hit Him And Go To Jail Yeah, right. Can't hit him. Can't walk in there, say, "I challenge you." This is the modern era. LOL
Nope Never seen him in action, which is why I'm asking if anybody has. A guy that I know has been in his form class for like 8 months now, and hasn't seen him do anything beyond teaching forms. Is the guy good?
My school sponsored a seminar given by him (I attended all three days). He is beyond good. We went through the entire long form, but he demonstrated martial applications all through the seminar -- he had my teacher flying across the room!
A few suggestions: A true traditional tai chi system takes from 8-10 years to be able to use it with effective martial application, most schools where they teach tai chi teach it only for excersise and do not believe in its martial applications you may also want to do some research as some tai chi styles have been altered by the people who inherited them in order to fit their physical attributes, I remember reading of someone who inherited a tai chi style and over the years became very overweight and could not do some of the techniques so he change the style and it became near close to useless. If you want to learn tai chi for self defense be ready to put many years into it and also you should look at what you are being taught, a good sign of martial tai chi is if the sifu incorporates push hands excersises and internal strength excersises in your training. These are usually implemented after you know the basic forms but every sifu is different so you should ask them about it. Tai Chi training without push hands and internal training is not geared towards making you a warrior, its geared more towards excersise.
