Is the Bujinkan teaching Kali Now? Shihan Dean Rostohar

Discussion in 'Filipino Martial Arts' started by MadMonk108, Jan 22, 2015.

  1. Please reality

    Please reality Back to basics

    No, I'm not saying that this is what he has done. Just asking if that is what he said he has done when asked about the material.:dunno: As we don't know what was asked and how it was answered, it is a hard call whether or not he is actually lying, or if he was wiggling around the fact that he was adding something else.

    I'm no expert in BBT, but the idea of blending the different arts in the Takamatsuden instead of concentrating on just one seems to be a good explanation. Not sure that it is necessary, as if you train them all in isolation, when you move you will naturally combine them, but that is a different story.

    As an example of Filipino movement, his videos don't impress me but that is neither here nor there. I'm just wondering if he said flat out that he hadn't studied Filipino arts when/if he was asked point blank about what he was teaching.

    I guess one could argue that ninjas used anything that worked and wouldn't have been tied down to just one way of doing things, so they would have used any art no matter its origins. There is some validity to this idea as they did incorporate technology and strategies(not to mention concrete skills) from China and Korea, however what he is allegedly claiming seems a stretch at best.
     
  2. ap Oweyn

    ap Oweyn Ret. Supporter

    But hasn't Hannibal repeatedly said in this thread that the guy in question said "this is ninjutsu"?
     
  3. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    He did...directly to MadMonk/Der Auslander
     
  4. Please reality

    Please reality Back to basics

    Oops, missed this reply. Well, who are we to question him, I mean he was after all the Croatian version of Chris Kyle and we aren't operators operating on operation?:rolleyes:

    Yes, if he said that after being asked point blank if he did any Filipino arts, then he's a tad :liar: touched it seems.
     
  5. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool the merc with the mouth MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Wow you cant tell he has a artificial leg from his videos, impressive movement skills.
     
  6. ap Oweyn

    ap Oweyn Ret. Supporter

    From what I gathered, it's not that he's saying he hasn't studied FMA. It's that he said that what's in the video was ninjutsu. Slight distinction. And if I've got the wrong end of that, MadMonk can correct me.
     
  7. MadMonk108

    MadMonk108 JKD/Kali Instructor

    Nope. That's pretty much it.
     
  8. Please reality

    Please reality Back to basics

    If he is claiming he didn't do FMA, obviously he is loony. If he is saying what he's doing is ninjutsu, I'd have to hear a good explanation as to why before I bought it. I don't see ninjutsu in a lot of his videos but that's just me.
     
  9. ap Oweyn

    ap Oweyn Ret. Supporter

    No, that's basically everyone involved in this conversation. ;)
     
  10. MadMonk108

    MadMonk108 JKD/Kali Instructor

    Talk of his past training didn't come up. Just that what was shown in video #1 is Bujinkan and if you can't grasp the Booj concepts then you aren't advanced enough to question him, and he should know, because he operated operationally as an operator.
     
  11. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    Operator as flip!
     
  12. Florete

    Florete Valued Member

    I have seen tantojustu from a high ranking Bujinkan practitioner, and it looked nothing like this at all. Don Roley Sensei was kind enough to send me a video of his knife work several years ago, and it was obvious to see the differences between it and FMA. http://www.coloradospringsninjutsu.com/Instructor.html

    In addition, one can look at the tantojutsu waza from Koryu and non-Koryu Japanese martial arts and see the distinct similarities with authentic Bujinkan tantojutsu and the distinct differences between that and what is shown in the video in the OP of this thread.
    http://www.ustjf.us/news/tanto-jutsu.html


    Mr. Rostohar has obviously studied FMA and is blending it in with whatever else he has done in the past. For the record, I don't have a problem with the blending thing, but one should be intellectually honest about what they are teaching as well as giving proper credit for where you got your skills and knowledge.


    If one is really interested in seeing Bujinkan knife work, I recommend contacting Mr. Roley at the link above. My experience communicating with him on other forums is that he is willing to share what he knows in regards to his art.

    In addition, I would highly recommend contacting Mr. Brian VanCice, who has studied both Bujinkan and FMA for many years. He could give a great perspective on the differences between FMA knife work, and Bujinkan tantojutsu. He has also seen Don Roley's knife material and commented to me on the noticable differences between it and FMA knife work, and that it was an excellent example of the way that Bujinkan approaches the knife.
    http://www.instinctiveresponsetraining.com/instructors.html
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2015
  13. ap Oweyn

    ap Oweyn Ret. Supporter

    Brian has also been a consistent contributor here. Hopefully he'll wander by soon and give us his thoughts.
     
  14. furinkazan

    furinkazan Valued Member

    When I was in my time at the bujinkan, I found there was a mixed bag of purists, and people who crosstrained into other arts to supplement it. I guess this is the case with this one, but I havent heard of anyone who incorporated any FMA into a class.

    tbh considering the shoddy stuff Ive seen, I think some people would benefit it :)
     
  15. ap Oweyn

    ap Oweyn Ret. Supporter

    Well, I'd agree with that. The question isn't whether they fit, to my mind. It's whether it's right to represent one AS the other and flatly deny the source if directly asked about it.

    I've seen quite a few ninjutsu teachers (from across the spectrum from sham to legit) incorporate some FMA. It makes sense.
     

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