I'm not 'writing karate off as a combat system altogether'. That would hardly make sense as I am in fact a student of wado ryu karate. Please refrain from constructing strawmen. Oh, and every time somebody says, in effect, 'oh yeah, come over here and say that' on the internet, a karate fairy dies. I don't feel qualified to talk about budo, as that area of eastern martial arts has never really interested me. But boxers seem to manage well enough. It is more difficult though, I admit. Even so, I could point at muay thai, etc.
Interesting, considereing the concept of budo is central to the study of Wadoryu (in which I see you are student)? Gary
Hmmmmm. well, quite rightly IMO it's not talked about a lot in class. I've done a small amount of research on my own, but I'm not greatly interested in oriental philosophy any more. I'm also very dubious about how relevant budo, bushido etc. are to modern martial arts, and maintain I have a perfect right to practice eastern martial arts within the framework of my own culture.
LOL I was merely responding to you describing karate as an international laughing stock. I must say for a young lad who's so far (checks profile) tried several martial arts and mastered absolutely none, you're quick to snipe at someone who actually knows what he's talking about. Gary
I guess budo doesn't have to be talked about to be understood - it is realised. If I didn't understand why I would be dubious too. Gary
Oh, is somebody getting a bit defensive? Bwahahahaaaa 'International laughing stock' might be a bit strong, but seriously, you should take a look around. It's not just the trolls on bullshido saying these things. You know, in most things, when the end user complains, the business/association/whatever at least has to pretend to take the complaint seriously...
Not at all. I'm only responsible for my own dojo and as long as I teach effective stuff that's enough for me. I just think sweeping generalisations like "International laughing stock" don't make a lot of sense. Absolutely agree, but then there's good and bad in everything, not just MA. I advise all new members to do just that, so they can decide if they want to be pushed or to be flattered. On the comment about training in your own way, I take a middle view. There are certain formalities that give order to the training process, but we don't use bows etc in my dojo to enforce subservience. I'm English, I don't pretend I'm Japanese. Gary
Brilliant... You mentioned the “Bull” word. Why is it that whenever I see that, the Deep South and white supremacy come to mind, along with a homogenised "Super bowl" view of "MMA". If ever there was a case of "dope" testing a web site – this is surely it. Gary
Yes, but you'll notice they were mentioned as part of a phrase. This phase was 'the trolls on bullshido'. Without wishing to start (another) MAP-bullshido war, this phrase is indicative of how I too feel about bullshido. Trolltown. By definition- and by design. I'm not really going to start arguing as a) I've had a difficult week and b) The truth is that the general standard of training in karate schools is nothing like as low as certain people would have you believe. Karate does need to think about quality control and its public image though.
I have heard that Karate guy used one punch to kill. I have not heard boxer did that yet. Karate is "combat" and boxing is "sport".
Yeah, well I've heard that there was an advanced civilisation millions of years ago called atlantis, and that Barak Obama is a communist. But there's no call for sensible people to go around believing that sort of rubbish. This misconception comes from an over-literal interpretation of 'ikken hisatsu'. As for bowing, meh, don't mind one way or the other. I'd prefer not to, but I don't think it makes much difference.
At punching? Yes, boxing is better than Karate. But then it's better than any other MA, too. Likewise with westling vs stand-up styles for training your ground game, or FMA for stick and knife fighting, so on and so on. Martial arts is an eternal game of rock, paper, scissors. One art will always be weaker AND superior to another. A good martial artist will be able to see where his art is weak and work on that to make it (him) stronger.
We agree 100%. I know some dojo where the Grand Poobah seems to insist on rather too much bowing though - all in their direction ... The term we use is "They show mutual respect and support" Gary
With regards 'boxing is superior to karate' I would love to see this person pitted against a good traditional karateka, I truly would. This is one instance in which the tired old maxim 'it's the artist, not the art' needs to be trotted out. It's a cliché, and not always true, but in this case it really is. Besides, karate fits in with judo much better than boxing does. I take the view that they share certain martial philosophies, 'delivery systems' and even some techniques.
Years ago I used to teach a private lesson for a heavyweight boxer (who wanted to learn to kick) every Wednesday morning. We always finished up sparring and his body punches were the worst I've ever felt. I kicked his legs to bits trying to stop him. We did that every week for months. I spoke to his wife years later and she told me he was as nervous as hell every time he came training. I remember dreading going to, but we both had too much pride so neither of us wanted to be the one to break off and run for cover. The moral: It's not what you do, it's the way that you do it (thanks Bananarama) and the attitude and spirit you bring with you. That can be found in all styles and all systems, and can be lacking in all styles and systems. Saying this is better than that is meaningless, it's individuals that make it so. Gary
Agreed, But it is the school / ryuha that "should" engender that way within the student in first place. Gary
Yeah, it's the old nature / nurture debate under different guise: Good Attitude + Good training = Best outcome Poor attitude + Good training OR Good attitude + Poor training = Doubtful Outcome Poor attitude + Poor training = Why bother? Any club will attract a broad spectrum of members. No matter how skilled the instructor and no matter what ethos he puts over, it's the individual effort that is key. People who hop from club to club always dissatisfied that they are not getting the ultimate training (as if any instructor will tailor make it to suit their personal taste) can often find the answer to their gripe a bit closer to home. Gary
And perhaps we come to the nub of it here. At what point does an instructor can only do so much for a student. After that it's a case of does he/she want to keep students to pay the rent? Gary
