Internal training in western boxing?

Discussion in 'Boxing' started by Madao13, Jul 3, 2012.

  1. inthespirit

    inthespirit ignant


    As I think I may have mentioned earlier, I don’t really believe in the internal/external divide. However, it may be easier IMO to perceive the internal/external divide as training which is more awareness focused vs repetition focused, but its not really that black and white.

    I guess this why Caveman is referring you the first page wherein there are some ideas that Sandow weight stuff is more mental (awareness) than physical (repetition).

    In any case, I’m pretty sure that the whole internal/external difference is not to denote training methods, but more to do with the origin of the arts, i.e. arising inside China (Taoist origin?) vs imported from abroad (Shaolin etc), I’m sure someone on here know more about this than I do.

    However, it does seem that the internal/external idea is now more associated with the type of training, my opinion on which is described above.

    Anyhow, here are some detailed opinions I just found:
  2. inthespirit

    inthespirit ignant

  3. Madao13

    Madao13 Valued Member

  4. inthespirit

    inthespirit ignant

    No worries dude. There is a lot of good stuff on that blog. The author posts here on rare occasions, a really down to earth and skilful guy!
  5. karl52

    karl52 openminded

    Here's a clip explaining a bit more about the Shockwave punching the three shockwaves we use are the light shockwave, the deep shockwave and the Ripping shockwave, just the light shockwave on a punch can be very effective and even cause a knockout, there's a steep up in power and explosiveness with the deep shock wave,then another step again in power with the ripping shockwave and this is the most powerful shockwave I teach, there's also more on how to receive or defend an incoming strike, and a closer look at the effect of the Bearpaw (a slap with a deep shockwave on the end) on a person.and the damage a slapping shockwave can have on flesh,If finger tips can do that much damage imagine what knuckles can do with a shockwave what's not touched on in the clips of the slaps is the pain factor,when a slapping shockwave lands there a massive amount of pain,significantly more than an ordinary slap,that overloads your nervous system and causes a blackout,I experienced this with every slap I took, even the slaps I took on the forearm,this would also explain the high percentage of slap KO's by Doormen
    We also touched on the differences with punching with the inside and outside knuckle, there's a significant step up in shock when you use the inside knuckle,to be honest when you line up the kinetic chain correctly the inside of the middle knuckle is where your punch should be landing,what makes it even more interesting is you cant throw an inside knuckle punch in a boxing glove?! so the most powerful way of punching with the knuckle Can't be done in modern boxing gloves(you cant even make a proper fist in modern boxing gloves)because of the fixed thumb,so often when you get MMA guys training in boxing gloves all the time,they punch like that in mma gloves instead of using the inside knuckle, this reduces the punches effectiveness significantly and also increases the chances of a boxers fracture because there throwing out there little knuckle first.
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2012
  6. Putrid

    Putrid Moved on

    I think you need to clarify this terminology as it is very confusing.What exactly do you mean by "inside of the middle knuckle"? I can fully understand last three knuckles,first two knuckles or middle knuckle but how do you punch with the inside of the middle knuckle? Well I suppose you can with a ripping shot but a lot depends on where the other guys head is and if he suddenly moves.
  7. puma

    puma Valued Member

    Yeah, I didn't understand that. And to be honest, I don't understand the reason for the videos being posted.
  8. karl52

    karl52 openminded

  9. karl52

    karl52 openminded

    Dont worry everybody's at a different level of learning,I didnt understand what he was teaching when I was there in the clip,It took me years of study to work it out and im still prefecting it.This sort of thing takes time to practice to fully understand.What I can say, if you dont understand what im on about now,when you do you will be hitting significantly harder,faster and more precise than you have before.In all my years training,there are two things that made the single biggest diffence's in my ability to hit with power,speed and precision,one was learning a natural kinetic chain from Dennis Jones,but the second and the one that made the biggest difference was the shockwaves and He also taught me to deliver them.

    best of luck with your training
  10. karl52

    karl52 openminded

  11. Putrid

    Putrid Moved on

    Thanks karl,that makes more sense.I have never bought into the idea of using the last three knuckles as in wing chun,or even as Jack Dempsey advocated.Destroying the little finger knuckle on the left hand when trying to punch the makiwara this way was enough to convince me it wasn't a good idea.
  12. karl52

    karl52 openminded

    Its not just the fact that the bones are smaller on the outside of the knuckle,its also that the three knuckle punch doesn't have the support of the arm behind it so you get less drive.I find its kinetically poor,I find the kinetic chain is delivered better with the inside of the middle knuckle or two knuckles,because this has the forearm behind it to support the strike.and in turn delivers a much crisper shockwave.
  13. Punchy

    Punchy Purely Practical

    Reps - Sets


    I have started trying this with 2Kg dumbbells and it seems like a good routine.

    One thing I could not find in the book or in the posts is how many reps and sets you do - or do you just keep on with a rhythmic movement until you are tired?

    Thank you
  14. karl52

    karl52 openminded

    HI punchy,

    I tend to do it for a couple of minutes at a time,we only use the weights for a few sessions to get an understanding what were trying to do, once you can understand the feeling your trying to get,you can train the same snap or shock without the weights in your hands, personally I would use something a bit lighter nothing over 1kg

    hope this helps
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2012

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