Internal power in karate

Discussion in 'Karate' started by davidp123, Jun 28, 2013.

  1. YouKnowWho

    YouKnowWho Valued Member

    To me, there is only a right way to move or a wrong way to move. There is no "internaL" way to move or "external" way to move. When you use your

    - limbs to generate power, you are doing it wrong.
    - body to generate power, you are doing it right.

    A correct Karate back reverse punch should be:

    - Borrow the counter force from the ground.
    - Bring it up through your back leg, hip, upper body, shoulder, and then reach to your arm.

    If you just "freeze" your body and punch from your arm, you are doing it wrong.
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2013
  2. Tom bayley

    Tom bayley Valued Member

    If your definition of chi and internal power states that it should allow 50 year olds to win in Olympic weight lifting or 5 foot tall men to out-sprint Usain Bolt, then I guess what you define as internal power does not exist.

    However to me it is an absurd definition.
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2013
  3. davidp123

    davidp123 Valued Member



    Very good application for the Yang form.
    i see connected body,subtle body mechanics suggesting what Rebel Wado was calling internalizing power
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2013
  4. GaryWado

    GaryWado Tired

    His posture looks wrong to me.

    Granted - I may be doing the poor guy an injustice, but he simply didn't look too centred to me?

    He seemed to be "reaching" rather than “controlling” if that makes sense.

    From an “internal power” perspective that is.
     
  5. GaryWado

    GaryWado Tired

    Also...

    What's with the long necklace?
     
  6. davidp123

    davidp123 Valued Member

    Granted the necklace is a bad idea!
    his martial effectiveness of the applications seem very good for Taiji
     
  7. GaryWado

    GaryWado Tired

    Is he your instructor?
     
  8. davidp123

    davidp123 Valued Member

    No Gary, he is not my instructor,i'm just using his Taiji as an example because it is good Taiji lol
     
  9. davidp123

    davidp123 Valued Member

    Gary,I read Wado Karate has Jujutsu roots,does it have internal practices brought from the Shindo Yoshin Ryu?
     
  10. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    This is Kent Howard displaying some form applications from Bagua (lineage from one of my heros Wang Shu Jin)

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dcHwh9D6epY"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dcHwh9D6epY[/ame]

    This is Wang himself kicking ass

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3331hHtPcbU"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3331hHtPcbU[/ame]

    Now interestingly if you compare the mechanics and flow to someone who has a more "external" reputation - in this case Our Lord Rickson - there is little difference except in the idiosyncrasy of the techniques

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hd6fXryCjiM"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hd6fXryCjiM[/ame]
     
  11. GaryWado

    GaryWado Tired

    Erm yes... as I already mentioned in post #28!

    Gary
     
  12. davidp123

    davidp123 Valued Member

    Thanks for the impatience,i appreciate it.
     
  13. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    He is being cheeky not snippy ;)
     
  14. davidp123

    davidp123 Valued Member

    Thanks for the links :hat:
     
  15. Rebel Wado

    Rebel Wado Valued Member

    This is where there is a difference between internal power and internalizing power.

    Most combat sports lead to the internalization of power because the mechanics are based on physics and tested under pressure. However, the techniques themselves, although effective and tested, can still end up watered down. For practical purposes, most martial arts is watered down yet still can be effective.

    The video you posted does DEMONSTRATE some good principles but the applications were done in a watered down manner. Because we live in mostly peaceful times, I don't see a big issue with initial reactions/responses being watered down to give the opportunity to assess the situation while still protecting yourself. However, from there, it should be allowed to follow up with progressively more detailed technique that is less watered down.

    In the video, the initial more watered down technique is not followed by a progressively less watered down technique (although there were some hints that they could be). The way to tell is look at the uke (opponent), at what point are they "dead"? Not really any point with the exception of the one time the defender sprawls and grabs him on both sides of the head (this could be a double eye gough and lead to a neck break... but hard to tell if that technique was hidden in the application used).

    A quick story told to me by one of my instructors. The event took place around 30 years ago or so. He was training in internal martial arts and his instructor was a very large and heavy American fellow. They were doing push hands and the instructor would send his opponents flying/back peddling across the room into walls. The visiting grandmaster (I think he called him Doc Wong) was a small Asian man well into his 70s by that time, stopped the lesson and told the big instructor to push hands with him.

    So the big instructor took the challenge. Soon, maybe instantaneously, when contact was made, the grandmaster struck the big instructor somewhere about the liver, with both hands, almost like doing CPR on him. The big instructor staggered back a few feet and then he just collapsed to the ground. It took him maybe ten minutes before he was able to get off the ground and stand with help.

    When he finally got up. The grandmaster asked if he wanted to try again. The big instructor declined, said he had had enough.

    So the sending people flying is a demonstration of the watered down or sport aspects. It can be effective and is nothing to look down upon... but to believe that you are a master because you can do that is to not understand the deeper lessons of the martial arts.
     
  16. GaryWado

    GaryWado Tired

    Why the snide remark?

    You asked a question.

    I gave you an answer.
     
  17. davidp123

    davidp123 Valued Member

    I was actually hoping for a bit of an expansion on the subject..
     
  18. GaryWado

    GaryWado Tired

    Read my post then!
     
  19. davidp123

    davidp123 Valued Member

    Gary in fairness i was only replying to the way u replied to my question,i asked a genuine question.
     
  20. davidp123

    davidp123 Valued Member

    Take it easy man.
     

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