Hi all, You have helped me out before, and i'm hoping you are kind enough to do the same again. As lockdown has given must of us a lot of time, i have spent a lot of time watching MA videos online. I been quite hooked on 'counter striking', i don't know if that is what its called, i believe its the same as JKD's the intercepting fist, rather than blocking and then striking. Here is a link to what i'm referring to. 1 min 48 sec is what i'm referring to. I know of Aikido, JKD and Wing chun 'specialise' in these of of techniques. Are there other MA that train like this? Is this effective in real life? I'm interested in your thoughts.
My Wado and traditional Jiu Jitsu instructor describes it as 'deflecting' rather than blocking. Move yourself off the line of the attack, retain contact with that limb if possible to control range, strike, then as needed you can strike again, grapple, or change range. We did something similar in Sanda, which is full contact with lots of pressure testing. That particular defence to a hook isn't something I've done, but the principle of it makes some sort of sense to me. Stepping in to take yourself away from where the shot was aimed, control the limb, strike. Moving from a palm strike straight to a takedown the way the video shows I've never tried so I can't comment on how effective that is, but I think I'd want more control than one arm holding his elbow.
The movement you highlight here is known as "Brush Knee & Strike" in Yang style Tai Chi. As with anything, it's as effective as you train it EDIT: Also, I just saw you're in Maidstone - I'm just up the road in Rochester
The basic idea of a move being used either defensively or offensively is a regular theme in CLF. As is simultaneously blocking and attacking rather than blocking and then attacking. The move at 1:48 with his left hand would be very similar to what we call a nop sau (sp?) in CLF.
I mean, I certainly wouldn't want anyone I know to see me punch like that but if I was putting it into the situations I train/have trained in, a wild hook is the closest thing I can think of to that movement. Having watched it a bit further he steps slightly past as he does the takedown, which improves it slightly, but I wouldn't put money on it being high percentage.
The head trainer at my Muay Thai gym has a background in Kali as well, and sometimes teaches things like that; some form of physical control/redirection of the incoming strike (not a dodge) combined with counter-striking. He also sometimes has us drill various trapping techniques--arm traps where they need to draw their hand back out of the trap through a narrow point are especially hard to get out of when you are wearing 16oz gloves. I recall one drill trapping your opponent's hook: you juke to the side that the hook is coming from, hooking their hook-throwing arm with your opposite-side arm, almost like you throw your own hook but with a vertical angle on it, so you scoop their arm and pull it a bit downward and come back with a counter straight or overhand punch that they will not really be able to block (they can try to slip your strike/off-balance you/etc, but their trapped arm will be unable to block, and their other arm can't really block effectively). This isn't intended to be a held trap, but more of a scoop & redirect out of the way as you throw one or two counter punches. They will be able to recover from the trap fairly quickly. I've been shown other traps that are quite hard to pull off, but if you do pull it off, are quite hard to get out of while wearing 16oz gloves, and you basically can freely strike your opponent while maintaining that (again, they can shift & move to try to slip your strikes or lessen their impact, they can off-balance you, but they can't effectively block). Almost all of the techniques I've been shown, at least the ones that have a reasonable chance of working, are very temporary--your opponent will get out of it fairly quickly, but it can open opportunities for a few quick strikes that your opponent has to deal with in some way other than blocking; often they will end up eating a few strikes before freeing themselves. I guess the other thing that comes to mind is the "split" punch--you combine a slip with a punch simultaneously. This is more of a dodge+counter as opposed to a trap/block/parry + counter. I'd also say the majority of counter striking that I've been shown is sequential--you block or dodge first, and then you counter before they can recover sufficiently to defend the counter effectively.
Which is also about +90% chance of whats coming at you. Especially at around 2300hrs if youre the Doorman begining to refuse entry/kicking out folk. Probably stepping back would work as well...lol
Attack on Preparation is kind of the bread and butter of epee discipline in Fencing (Foil/Sabre....not so much). I think to get there you need a reasonable amount of sparring experience and the ability to read your opponents intentions/body language so that you can stay ahead of the OODA loop and pre-empt his intent so that when he moves you are already moving even if fractionally. The problem lies more in the fact that in Sport metas, the opponents start some distance away with no element of suprise. In Self defence situations you may have no space and no time, particularly if you are not dealing with a Social Monkey dance but with a Predator who will use either Shock or Charm to get in closer to crush the space. This is not to say that combat sports lead you into bad habits, quite the opposite you get to practice all the basic techniques. Its just the counter assualt element that is missing. For example drawing the sword swiftly from the scabbard so that you can parry in Prime guard and covering most lines was a viable and necessary skill in western fencing if someone had the jump on you (mugger, robber, footpad etc). I Imagine Iaido had a similar purpose but from another perspective but the concept is the same unarmed. The choices become either building a platform to weather the storm (Crazy monkey defence/Flinch response) so that you can bring your A game, or Pre-empt the attack by reading the opponents body language or intentions (i.e JKD stop hit). (Unless there are other choices Mappers! Run Fu? Answers on a postcard please) Both are tricky to pull off if you don't train for them.
Every striking art has these techniques, attack as they are attacking. I've seen it plenty of times in boxing, one labelled technique is the check hook. This was a common drill we did in kungfu also, in essence the block/cover is a fail safe, but you can employ the strike without the block/cover. I've seen and used the same with kicking also; a straight front leg or side kick against a roundhouse. It's certainly effective in real life and against live opponents. Easy to pull off when you are able to read "tell" or any telegraph from the attacker.
No art recommends responding to an attacker with a a single action in a single beat. it gives the attacker control of your movements. it gives you no improvement on your situation. it gives you no control of the attacker. In my class the word "block" is banned. I use the word "counter" instead. I recently learned that the word "uke" usually translated as Block in most English karate classes is better translated as "reception". The exception that proves the rule. I do have a number of actions that I do call "oh sh" blocks. for when you realise that everything has gone horribly wrong and you might just have time to cover up. This is not a situation that you want to get into but it happens.
Is your striking art even a striking art if it didnt have some form of this concept anyway? However you do it, its a reactionary simultaneous counter strike.
the Op refers to blocking then striking. i.e. block on beat one, strike on beat two. To clarify. - by single action I mean an action with a single intent. i.e. Just fending of a strike from hitting you. - fending off an attack does not in and of itself improve your position or make your attackers position worse. Hence why I make the distinction between a block and a reception or counter, a reception fends off the attacker whilst at the same time doing something else as well, affecting the attacker - countering there movement, pulling them on etc, and /or allowing for you to simultaneously move to improve your own position. like I say all arts do this. for me "the way of the intercepting fist" is a good marketing brand, and it contains a lot of practical stuff, but does not contain anything unique.
The takeaway I get from the video, which is something that I agree with, is that there can be a tendency in martial training, to become complicated. Perhaps a better approach is to keep it simple and direct. I think the complex training can be useful in the big picture, as long as complex does not just become complicated. Complicated is not a good thing, in martial training. Complex can become a thorough training in physical education, which can give you a broad vision of what is possible. But when it comes to useage, simple and direct is your bread and butter. In my estimation, if you have five or six fundamental techniques, an ability to use them creatively, and a fundamental strategy, that will get you through 98% of what you are likely to encounter in an attack. This won’t hold true in competition where opponents study each other’s history in preparation for the fight, the fight is in a controlled setting and lasts longer, etc. In that case, greater variety becomes more important. So it depends on what your goals are.
"Block" is a misnomer; "receiver," is a better translation for TKD/Karate folks. Simultaneous receive and counter is pretty common in those arts as I know them, though I'm always happy to be corrected. In this case though I'd be inerested in people's opinion as I'm not sure this is the highest % response, within the SD context the video provides. From my old folks point of view, I'd worry about my ability to stop a big swinging punch with bodyweight behind it with one arm, and the fact that his other hand is already on its way in a classic windmill. As I deliver my palm strike, he's delivering his left, so I'd better time things perfectly or I'm in trouble, and if I miss he still has options. Personally, I'd step and cover with both hands, putting the right to his neck to prevent his left attack and gain some control. I think that's a higher % technique for my safety, and leaves me in a good position to control and strike.
When your opponent uses straight punch toward your face, you can respond with the following way. 1. Dodge (this is like a No-op). 2. Deflect (30 degree toward your own head). 3. Intercept (90 degree to your opponent's arm). 4. Jam (30 degree toward your opponent's head). Besides 1, IMO, 2 < 3 < 4. You should block away from your own head, and close to your opponent's head. Try to fight in your opponent's territory instead of try to fight in your own territory.
