Integrity in Ninjutsu

It's almost the end of another year, and yet I find the world of ninjutsu hasn't changed much. There are still those who wish to profit off the name of the art yet aren't intellectually honest enough in their approach to admit that they haven't the slightest clue about the true traditions.

We've had people set up their strange and convoluted explanations of how and why ninjutsu was passed on, from SKH's godai, to Ben's Balls, and now we have Rob Renner and his Zero Points. Each was an excuse, a way of explaining away it's creator's lack of ability and understanding by shifting the locus of attention away from the real art and its techniques, to some new paradigm that promised Westerners a better way to understand and improve in ninjutsu. However, all were just the figments of the imagination of some guy who just couldn't do it. Funny that the Japanese masters of the arts never went on to create such concepts, nor did they make excuses for any lack of their own ability. If and when they split from Hatsumi sensei's teachings, it was always for personal reasons, not taijutsu related ones.

Watching a video of Renner's seminar that I posted here,

http://www.martialartsplanet.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1074970808&postcount=2104

I was utterly shocked to see him parodying something as basic as our tsuki and ichimonji(at 38 minutes into the video to 41 minutes), and showing how things that may work in armour traditionally were unrealistic for today's streets, yet then go on to demonstrate and teach something that didn't make sense from a physical standpoint and that could only work when people played nice with slow motion non resistant larping. Not only did I find his lack of understanding surprising, but the excuse for creating his system was dishonest. There wasn't any lack of applicability of the traditional techniques, it was that he couldn't apply them. This is a big difference and gets back to integrity. If your martial system is broke, you don't try to fix it, you leave it for something that isn't broken. Staying within the aegis of the system but propagating something entirely new while ostensibly practicing the old system is living a lie.

It's about time people start telling the truth and either following the path of advancement in these arts or being honest enough to admit that they can't hack it and disappearing like a real ninja would.

 

Unfortunately renner is usually to busy looking in the mirror to pick up on anything being taught , so how he thinks he knows stuff is beyond me . There are way to many people letting renner and quite a few other people show them there rubbish interpretations of what the japanese shihan teach . It is becoming quite a joke , I see more and more of these people coming to australia teaching seminars , saying they are big ninja experts , when aussies who have trained and lived in japan for over 20 - 30 yrs dont even get a look in . Very sad

 

Well definitely some troubling thoughts.
A the amount of high rankers that either depart to go their own, or the amount of high rankers that maintain membership and reteach it in their own, well distanced from the Kihon.
But B. How did they get to this level, if they did not have the appropriate skill in the first place and where does that responsibility lie. There are not just a few renegades in the Bujinkan sadly that does this, There is what seems to be a huge population spreading this very sad state martial art around the world, if by looking at the bad vids thread

I had my reasons for leaving. Doing what I did.
In the end. I let it go. I am 100% retired. But, this does bring up questions. I remember Renner at the 2000 Tai Kai I think. Think I trained with him on the floor. Did have very nice hair.

 

Which Aussies have lived and trained in Japan for 20+ years?

 

It gets back to the word "integrity." It takes integrity to turn down a rank, to admit you don't understand, to resist the urge to henka your way out of an uncomfortable situation. To say to yourself and others that you aren't ready or don't know how to make things work but you are going to stick to doing it as you were taught until you can. That is how we grow, and become true martial artists. The other way is admitting it isn't for you and walking away. Staying, teaching, and profiting from an art when you don't know it or can't do it so create band aids to try to fix what isn't broken, is neither honest, fruitful, nor very intelligent.

The rank issue is really a chicken and egg thing. Which came first, the foreigners trying to make a name for themselves, or the teacher willing to let them play that game? Was it sakitsuke(giving out a rank that they could grow into), or something else? In the end, we are all adults and have to take responsibility for our own martial path. Blaming dad, the sensei, or anyone other than ourselves is a crap out and cannot result in true martial skill or virtue.

 

I had forgotten about Ben's balls!

 

If the student isn't ready for the rank they shouldn't be promoted. Fault is with the person doing the promotion.

If these folks are awarding themselves some high rank that is of course a different story.

 

And of course people who are trying hard and putting in the blood, sweat, and tears, obviously aren't a problem. The problem is with those who are trying to fake it till they break it since they'll never make it. That there are those who would rather bask in the limelight and notoriety that their inflated rank brings them instead of trying to become worthy of it. That many go around worshipping such foreign "Shihan" instead of calling them out on their nonsense is another issue, but nobody is faulting people who are truly trying dunc.

 

Two things, in traditional Japanese culture, there is a concept of giving someone a promotion ahead of them being ready, with the understanding that this will motivate them to grow into it. Also, as we aren't talking about child Tae Kwon Do classes, there is also this Western concept of not accepting things you aren't entitled to(or worth in your own estimation). If you are a Westerner yet are some 10th degree, black sash Grandmaster/Sifu/Sensei/Guro Bob (or whatever the equivalent is in your own art), whom hasn't put in at least 40 years of constant training, you are what people point to when they look at the avarice and nonsense that inculcate the martial arts world today.

To put it more succinctly, if you are an adult and are faulting others for your behaviour, you are still living the dream.

 

Apparently the "growing into the rank" system isn't working, whoever is doing it needs to knock it off, this is part of quality control. Fault is with the instructor. I don't care what your culture is, if you don't like the product you need to revise how the product is made.

And I certainly agree with the idea of refusing rank that you aren't ready for. But I am curious, could I refuse promotion to a rank or does that call my instructor's judgement into question, can I do it without insulting him/her/it?

 

Whether it's working or not isn't the issue, there are a thousand threads that cover qc and rank in the Bujinkan. If you are an adult, the fault is always with you if you want to change something in your own life and have yet to do so. Sorry, but we're not kids and we're not in Kansas anymore. Any excuse not to take responsibility for yourself shows that you are not ready. Potentially insulting your instructor's judgement is more important than maintaining your integrity as an adult and a martial artist? :thinking:

Whether we agree with the practice or not, giving rank early is one aspect of Japanese culture. If you are studying a Japanese martial art, that is something you should take into consideration. There is also nothing wrong with the product(the actual arts), just they weren't made for everyone and mastery is a long, arduous path. If you don't like the art or can't make it work for you, you shouldn't create something inane and ineffective as a smokescreen or some kind of cure all for your personal limitations. If you do, your integrity should be called into question.

 

I was asking if it would cause an insult. Would it? What is the Japanese cultural practice with regard to refusing a promotion? How about a gift? I am asking because I don't know.

I don't do ninjutsu, I see enough instructor rank being given away to not great instructors in my own art. But in my art I blame the guys who give the rank. Would these guys be an issue if they never were never promoted past shodan?

 

It's neither here nor there whether it would cause an insult. If you have integrity, you will take responsibility for your choices and actions and deal with them appropriately. You can blame whomever you like, but the fact is that as adults, we should all take responsibility for ourselves. Unless you are forced to except rank or be executed, there isn't any excuse for the people accepting rank. Excuses like, "It's rude not to accept rank in Japan if offered," are just that. Excuses. As martial artists, if people made fewer excuses, things would be a lot better, at least the martial arts wouldn't be seen as laughable. I think we're both clear on where each other stands on this issue, it's fine to agree to disagree. It's not really the issue of this thread, so I'd prefer not to spend anymore time on it.

The question is why do we continue to have generation after generation of Western "moderniser" come out with some cockamamy philosophy to try to explain and excuse faults in their taijutsu? If they were true to themselves, they would just admit that they were clueless and either leave or try to figure out why they couldn't match the performance of the Japanese masters.

 

So if the one giving the rank is also and adult, does responsibility lie with them as well. Lot of doublespeak.
When I was in Japan, my Sensei was not happy about me for a sakki test. It was not his suggestion. I doubted I really was. I was given hell about even considering it. Which was fine. Mind you, having him strut like a school girl 20 minutes later after going from Godan to Kudan. I wonder if he was ready or should have turned that down.

How many Shihan are there in the Bujinkan. How many of them are worth while or should have denied their promotion?

Who's fault are all or some of them? If I am the president of my company. And for that matter I do run a 3 million dollar business unit. If there is issues, they will remove me. I am responsible for making the decisions that either make us successful or fail. So far I am lucky I have made the right moves. As a leader, that is what it is. I am responsible.

Covertly. In the arts. I recognized that both I was disappointed with what "Ninjutsu" had turned to be. In addition I was not happy with my product anymore. Or my own personal product anymore. My passion had been sucked out of me. So I gave it all up. Even after dropping any Japanese moniker. Just didn't enjoy it. I felt like I was not giving what the art deserved.
But it was my responsibility.


If the Jinenkan sucked, it would be due to Manaka Sensei. I have seen other schools put to the coals here and it was due to their Sensei. So, why is it now that leadership is not accountable, as it should be what the student accepted as a promotion or some secret language they should have known to turn it down.

 

Sounds like you have a lot of angst, probably best you left. If you are a cop, and someone offers what you expect is a bribe and you take it, do you get to blame it on them at the hearing? No, you should hold yourself to a higher standard, because the law does. Offering something that you don't deserve is a test, a test which many fail. No matter why it is offered, it is always up to you to take it or leave it. The arts are the important thing, that and learning them. If you aren't learning them and aren't living up to them, then you are a problem. Simple as that. In my mind there is no award that is worth your dignity and integrity. So either do your utmost to learn the arts or don't, but don't make excuses for whichever path you chose.

There is always temptation in life, temptation to take shortcuts, to cheat, to lie. It is readily apparent which path people chose when it comes to rank, so it's actually a good thing in a way, because it helps you identify who is who. It's only when people fall into the trap of their ego and start believing the hype, that rank becomes a problem, and for many it is. However, the issue of rank is irrelevant to the arts. The ryu don't care who has what patch, medal, or belt. Only if you can walk the talk. That is what I concentrate on, because I don't want to be one of those people out there who thinks they know something or are pleased with their accolades but couldn't fight their way out of a hydrated papyrus holding unit.

 

LOL. Quite the opposite I feel great about quite a bit.
I don't have a horse in this game anymore so I call it the way I see it. That's it.
As for there not being any importance on rank. That is fluff.
As it is one of the biggest discussions going. So for some it may not be an issue and that is fine.

If someones rank and performance isn't a concern of others then the bad video thread wouldn't be 9 million pages long. If you wish to not be the one to judge others and you are not bothered by it. Then, that thread would not exist and ye would not be judging.
Certainly without your own merits being put to it.
I am well aware many will vouch for your merits. But others will vouch for others merits that get charcoaled.

Fun game of ring around the rosey

Honestly. You are right. I should have left. And it was good that I did.

 

Seems like a weird reversal to blame students for accepting ranks they don't deserve - quality control has always struck me as a responsibility for leaders of the art because they are the ones who suffer most for its lack.

 

That's just it, it's quite simple. The arts are there because there is something valuable in them. That is why they have survived for generations. Them surviving is because a few people in each generation have been able to pass their secrets down. As such, big organisations and lots of students aren't necessarily relevant to that transmission. This has always been the way traditional Asian arts are passed down, though the many may be exposed to them, only the few get the true art. Being allowed to study isn't a right, it is a privilege and where you mistake your participation in such, you end up screwing yourself.

Quality control is there, in that there are a select few who have mastered the arts and they are also passing it down to their deshi as has always been the case.

Rank, personal empires, own's own egotistical involvement and concern aside, the ryu are getting transmitted and that is the bottom line. I don't really have a stake either way, just calling things like I see them as well. For me, it is enough to train and be exposed to what I am allowed to, and to try to master it in my lifetime. The rest is really just window dressing, you can't take rank to your grave and your belt won't fight for you. In the grander scheme of things, they are irrelevant.

Would you take money that didn't belong to you if nobody could see you and you would never get caught? The answer has to do with integrity. We are adults, not kids, so why would you blame someone else for your own behaviour, for your own martial path? "If only my teacher would, if only my parents had, if only my wife hadn't," as a martial artist where does any excuse making lead you?

In the end it is always, "If only I had..." So if you have excuses to make, you should man up instead. People look everywhere but within themselves, that is why those people will never master the arts. If that isn't why you are training, then you have to question what is your reason.

 

If someone hires a dance coach, I expect they're looking for objective coaching, They haven't hired them to blow smoke up their patootie. Were a dance coach to do so and then publicly state that their student was an accomplished dancer, well, that reflects on them more than it does their students. If they do it so often that people begin to associate the Samba with ungainly, awkward movements, well, who's to blame?