Inosanto / Lacoste connection

Doh!

Firstly, Thanks I am gald you realise we are funny and have a sense of humour, we also have a sense of reality too, I don't know if we can say the same for you young boy (after all that is what you are is it not).
Secondly, if you can not see the grace in the art and beleive it has no honor then well I am affraid you have missed the boat all together and I feel sorry for you because, you do not know what you are missing.

I am affraid what you know when it comes to the FMA or the martial arts as a whole is absolutely NOTHING.

The Samurai used swords and knives to be-head people, the knights of old done the same, even the Shaolin Monks were known to partake in alittle be-heading in battle, all of them where known to be honorable and gracefull in the art, the same is true of real Eskrimadors, Arnisadors and Kalistas, many who fought the Japanese in WWII are testimony to this fact, the same I am affraid cannot be said of you young lad. You have no grace, you have no honor and most of all I feel you have no knowledge of FMA.

As for reading our FMA history, I know many of us here in the Forum know much more about the history of the FMA than you do, your version of the history must have come from some who I feel must be making it up as he/she goes along just to keep your young impressionable mind impressed.

As for the FMA having not being used for competition all can can say to you is DOH. I myself have won over 40 titles in FMA competition, I am sure their are a few more here that have partaken in the competition side of the FMA. Although many of these competition participants will also be the first to admit that the COMPETITION side to the FMA is a training tool to be used to benefit certain aspects of thier combat skills, it is at the end of the day a competition between fellow FMA practitioners.
And for you information that may help in your research in to the history of the FMA even some GM's have partaken in competition such as the first WEKAF World Championships held in Cebu City way back in 1989 and long before this in the Barrio Fiesta in many towns and villages.

Many here have been practicing the FMA with grace and honor long before you were a twinkle in your old-mans eye and many have on numoerous occasions asked you to name your Guro, show us the video, give us the proof and tell us who these GM Gangsters and Killers are. But so far what have you given us, NOTHING except but infantile responces with no evidance, background or even standing that you have in-fact have any base in the REAL FMA ARTS (ART FORM).

Your head is simply stuck in the clouds and you need to pull your head out of you backside and have a good look around at the real world, you never know with a little honor you may wel learn something.

So unless you have any usefull information that is based in fact then I suggest you go back to your Guro and keep on training because I am sure that by the time you are good enough to even share the same room with many of the FMA practioners here they will either be too old to care or have been a long time dead and their Grandchildren will be passing on their history to their own children.

I wish you well in your search for the real FMA because I know you still have a long raod to walk young man and at the moment I hate to tell you this, "YOU ARE WALKING IN THE WRONG DIRECTION". :cry:

 

trolls...

Ah...the crux of the matter...







Not too deep I hope....

My love, you know where I live...but where do you live?

Best,

Steve

 

In Australia we refer to people like jkdknifer as a Muppet.

In answer to your question about who his teacher is Pat, I think we will find that the only FMA training the boy in diapers has participated in, is via his Unique Publications videos (not that there are anything wrong with their videos).

 

Well... he's keeping the thread alive?

But getting back on topic, I do recall hearing Guro Dan credit Juanito Lacoste with most of his fma empty hands (especially the grappling aspect) and the corte (close in) fighting range of his stick work. What I found informative was that the grappling looked very much like catch-wrestling or even bjj, but Guro Dan was adamant that it was fma that he learned from Mr. Lacoste and then he would proceed to show the technical differences between that art and catch or bjj.

Unfortunately I don't recall much in the way of Mr. Lacoste's own background (lineage?). Does anyone know if he was born in the United States or the Philippines (which part?)? Who were his teachers and what style did they do? Tragically, the only other thing I know about Mr. Lacoste was how he was murdered.

 

Nice bringing the thread back on Track DV

hopefully this helps as well


From "Dan Inosanto, The Man, The Teacher, The Artist"

 

"Guro John LaCoste taught Dan kali-escrima-kuntao silat (bersilat) panatukan, dumog-kapulubud, and panjakan."
"but his favorites were the Muslim system of the southern Philippines,"

Curious, Anyone know what aspects of the Inosanto Kali blend specificly is from kuntao silat and what the origin of Juanito Lacoste's silat knowledge is?

 

Bersilat would refer to Malaysian silat. Crucible I pm'd you.

 

"Guro LaCoste studied and was familiar with many different styles, but his favorites were the Muslim system of the southern Philippines"

Bersilat may refer to Malaysian silat, but it doesn't explain this statement. I wonder if his study of southern Philipine arts was limited specificly to just the weapon arts or to kuntao or silat. If it was weapon arts it may gotten integrated with his escrima. If he did train in Malaysian silat, how? Was he a merchant seaman, did he pass through Mindanao to get there? If so it makes sense he might of stayed in Mindanao for a while. At the same time the JKD pangamut, Maphilindo silat and Inosanto blend I've seen doesn't remind me of arts I've seen from Mindanao. Mind you, I don't know what aspects of JKD Kali are specificly from Juanito Lacoste, my experiance of JKD is as an observer not a practitioner and I have so much still to see and learn of the arts in the southern Philipines. Thoughts anyone?

 

"I fail to see what filipino masters with real fighting experience could learn from "guro" innosanto..."


Well, for one thing, humility, openness to new methods, cross-system appreciation, compassion, a willingness to share (unabridged) the depth of his knowledge with even the most frustrating students.




"...teacher doesn't equate to fighter..... peoples in the in the west didn't have that many opportunities to see real filipino grandmasters to compare with..."


You have that backwards, sir: A great fighter does not equate to a great teacher.
What the hell good is a great fighter if they cannot explain to you how to develop that level of skill and insight?


A lot has been said about Guro Inosanto in this discussion, debating the facts of his training, the prowess of his teachers, and all the inherent arguments that come when you start dropping terms like master, dangerous, true art, yada yada...

The fact of the matter is that when you get approached in the alley, when you get jumped in the men's room of the bar, when you get chased down by a road rage maniac, it's not going to matter where you teacher trained, what system is better than what system, or who said what to verify so and so's reputation - it will still come down to you, and only you.

When we talk about mastery, the qualities of one who is seen as a master of a system, shouldn't we prize more highly the things that they can offer us, than the things they can take away?

I also think, in my not so humble opinion, that those who would question the contributions of someone like Guro Inosanto should spend a seminar or two to evaluate the experience of his training in person. Who knows, you might even learn something.

- Moe

 

a qoute from my guro "training with guro Dan Inosanto, is like drinking out of a fire hydrant"

 

i know very little about DI except for the fact that he trained with Bruce Lee and helped him form JKD. What kind of Eskrima did DI train in? i myself train in Inayan Eskrima and absolutly love it! but some day i think it would be cool to check out JKD or Inosanto Kali (in my idea they are pretty closely related).

 

First of all what I have to say concerns fmas in general and isn't a personal attack on DI.

At least there is a chance to learn how to fight from a great fighter, many masters of old weren't good teachers but perpetuated their art and produced good fighters.
If the instructor doesn't know how to fight what can he teach?
Humility, compassion, open mindedness, fine, but I don't need to go to a martial arts class to learn this... My first escrima instructor (non filipino) was a nice guy, patient, compassionate, who could easily pass his knowledge but what he taught was of no use. I'd had already bled to death had I kept training with him....

The way you train, the way you fight...... Ultimately it comes to you but believe me if your instructor prepared you only for the gym you will have a hard time the day somebody armed with bad intentions pays you a visit at your home in order to talk business...

 

i agree. but how did you know what he taught you was of little use? i currently take Inayan Eskrima and think of it as very affectiective but what you say worries.

 

After two months he made the mistake of sparing with my training partner and I....
At that time I got only the basics of arnis but had some experience in silat and boxing (some knowledge of footwork and timing), I kept on hitting his hands, when he tried a silly jump I even hit him in the groin with my stick and he fell to the floor.....My t.p. did the same kind of things... When he tried his panantukan with a guy who'd done 1 year of boxing he got easily knocked down...

The owner of the gym, Charles Joussolt, an internationaly known silat expert who has a lot of street experience kept on telling us what he was teaching was B.S and that we should stop practicing with him. He later closed this arnis class and kicked the instructor out...

 

i see. it appears i am easily worried. although i know my instructor is highly qualified and he teaches great technique as well as application.

 

I don't know if anybody's mentioned it yet, but with all this talk about how good a person and teacher Guro Dan is, maybe I should mention.... There's no doubt in my mind that he can fight. In fact, I can't think of anybody his age (+/- ten years) who comes near him in terms of physical fitness or technical ability. Being a nice guy doesn't preclude an ability to kick a$$, we just have to be pushed a little harder.